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XSI

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The balls are pretty fragile and those things are pretty powerful
I would not consider it too far out there for a guy to get some internal damage from the pure blunt trauma of it all. Probably not 'obliterating' his crown jewels entirely, but definitely enough that he'd be paralysed by pain and had to be carried off, possibly with lasting damage

It is worded as clickbait, but even formerly reputable news establishments word their articles like clickbait these days
But I'll throw some more clickbait-y sounding stuff out there for you then. Though this one also seems like it's possible



If your marriage gets broken up by a game, it probably was already almost busted before that
 

Pervy

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I'm not even sure you could turn a shirt into a projectile worthy of the name with any means, as at some velocity friction within the chamber would cause enough heat to atomize cloth.
Ooh a challenge!

Most cloth is a mixture of cotton and polyester, luckily, those have super close melting points, 250° C approximately. Keep in mind, that's the melting point. You wanted to ATOMIZE it, which I'll generously presume doesn't mean actual molecular breakdown but a change from a liquid into a gaseous or plasma state. Those molecules both basically break down into the same things, the hardest of which to liquify is carbon. Carbon is that black stuff that remains when you burn other stuff.. and it's also really hard to burn up itself. It begins liquefying at temperatures of over 3550° Celsius.. and that allows us a lot of heat friction.

So, how much mass do we actually expel that's relevant. Let's use polyester with a better defined atomic mass to make this easier on us, and cheap shirts are mostly polyester or something comparable anyway. We have:
Molecular Formula:C27H38O14Molecular Weight:586.587 g/mol
now the H and O's all turn into water vapor, molecular mass is 16 for Oxygen, 1 for Hydrogen, 6 for carbon. So, now we need the weight of a T'shirt, ask google:
So, a small Fruit Of The Loom Budget t-shirt weighs 128 grams / 4.5oz. A medium Gildan Softstyle t-shirt weighs 138 grams / 4.86oz. And an XL American Apparel t-shirt 50/50 weighs 156 grams / 5.5oz. So, an average t-shirt will probably weigh about 130 grams to 150 grams.

Let's go with 140 grams. Almost there, now we do some chemistry math!
27 x 6, 14 x 16 +38
162, 224 and 38. now this differs from the actual molecular weight because the Polyester chains have different lengths.. and yes, the benzole group also would be harder to burn up due to its strong enthalpic bonds, but lets cast all that aside, we're looking at pure yield potential here, plus ignoring all chemical bondaging means we are looking at a more minimum yield yet.
What we can tell is that the rough amount of carbon in here is 150 : 250, or a bit over a third, a sum that'd suprise no one knowing organic chemistry.

So we are looking at, to round down again, 37% of 140, or a round 50 gram of carbon from the burned up T-shirts.. Now, we look at the mass of a Bullet, because that, together with the pointyness, does the damage. The point of force is half irrelevant here.. skin and flesh is not that resistant to impact damage as a material and we can impart almost any velocity as per your specifications, as long as we don't vaporize our carbon.:
Depending on the gun, the mass of a bullet usually ranges between 0.02 kilograms and 0.04 kilograms. The mass of a bullet depends on the caliber and type of gun used. A bullet can be fired from a revolver, pistol, rifle, machine gun or other weapon.
So, for those that didn't pay attention to metrics, our T-shirt bullet with 0.05 Kg is above most normal bullets in weight of pure carbon. If that mass hits you at the right velocity, you're in trouble.

BUT AIR FRICTION! Doesn't matter at all, you can completely ignore air-friction, we're at this point dealing with a rough sphere of burned up carbon, sure, the resistance is going to deform it.. into its most aerodynamic shape. there's some opposing force from the air, of course, just like there is on bullets.
Now we know the velocity at which a bullet can do damage, that means, all that's left is for us is to be dense, or rather, look at the density of carbon vs lead (What bullets are primarly made off ofc), the denser a material the heavier it is per surface area, meaning the more damage I can do. We have a rounded 2 for Carbon vs an 11 for lead, or a 1 to 5.5 ratio.

So. to simplify, a 50 gramm bullet of carbon does the same damage, at the same velocity, as a lead bullet of about 9 gram weight. Can that do damage?.. Well, it's still heavier than the lighest gun shell around. So yes.

But! We are not talking average velocity, you see, the melting point of lead is only ~330 °C. Carbon is, we recall, at ten times that amount just to MELT And lead bullets do not vaporize into nothing in thin air, So, while our Carbon payload faces over five times more resistance due to it's lower density, it can handle over ten times the acceleration force without melting.
So, we're doing, at bare minimum, the same damage as 90 gram of lead, spread over a larger area of impact, but so are shotguns. Now, Shotgun shells are weighted in nonsensical nonmetric american units like gauges and grains and their weight varies heavily, but even using heavy rounds, I reckon that'd still be several@shotgungunshot 's. Completely ignoring the molten stuff coming at you, yes, this would do damage.

Now keep in mind, there are realistic objections to this, but most are waved away by Slicer stating I could use 'any means' to turn the t-shirt into a projectile, to, I presume impart Velocity, that means I can choose a barrel that wouldn't melt up itself first, I don't have to worry about the shooter and Newton's laws (aka, recoil), or the energy source used to power our higly impractical shotgun.

TL/DR: NEVER understimate the physics of energy working on objects.
 
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Cyriel

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T-Shirt railgun with magnetized particles in the cloth is the only logical conclusion here.
 

Pervy

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T-Shirt railgun with magnetized particles in the cloth is the only logical conclusion here.
I mean, make a gauss-gun long enough, you can accelerate pretty much anything, though ironically, the Iron (the only reasonable candidate for FERRO-magnetism), would melt up 2000 ° Celsius below Carbon. Don't worry, no metal can beat carbon. People underestimate Carbon until they remember diamonds are made of that stuff too.
Teachers credit for anyone who can tell me why carbon's so hard to melt(well, not technically melt-melt, but lets not derail) compared to other things.
 

XSI

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Wasn't carbon the one that has no molecules, and instead had every bit of carbon connect to other carbon in a big web of solid carbon?
 

super_slicer

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Ooh a challenge!

Most cloth is a mixture of cotton and polyester, luckily, those have super close melting points, 250° C approximately. Keep in mind, that's the melting point. You wanted to ATOMIZE it, which I'll generously presume doesn't mean actual molecular breakdown but a change from a liquid into a gaseous or plasma state. Those molecules both basically break down into the same things, the hardest of which to liquify is carbon. Carbon is that black stuff that remains when you burn other stuff.. and it's also really hard to burn up itself. It begins liquefying at temperatures of over 3550° Celsius.. and that allows us a lot of heat friction.

So, how much mass do we actually expel that's relevant. Let's use polyester with a better defined atomic mass to make this easier on us, and cheap shirts are mostly polyester or something comparable anyway. We have:
Molecular Formula:C27H38O14Molecular Weight:586.587 g/mol
now the H and O's all turn into water vapor, molecular mass is 16 for Oxygen, 1 for Hydrogen, 6 for carbon. So, now we need the weight of a T'shirt, ask google:
So, a small Fruit Of The Loom Budget t-shirt weighs 128 grams / 4.5oz. A medium Gildan Softstyle t-shirt weighs 138 grams / 4.86oz. And an XL American Apparel t-shirt 50/50 weighs 156 grams / 5.5oz. So, an average t-shirt will probably weigh about 130 grams to 150 grams.

Let's go with 140 grams. Almost there, now we do some chemistry math!
27 x 6, 14 x 16 +38
162, 224 and 38. now this differs from the actual molecular weight because the Polyester chains have different lengths.. and yes, the benzole group also would be harder to burn up due to its strong enthalpic bonds, but lets cast all that aside, we're looking at pure yield potential here, plus ignoring all chemical bondaging means we are looking at a more minimum yield yet.
What we can tell is that the rough amount of carbon in here is 150 : 250, or a bit over a third, a sum that'd suprise no one knowing organic chemistry.

So we are looking at, to round down again, 37% of 140, or a round 50 gram of carbon from the burned up T-shirts.. Now, we look at the mass of a Bullet, because that, together with the pointyness, does the damage. The point of force is half irrelevant here.. skin and flesh is not that resistant to impact damage as a material and we can impart almost any velocity as per your specifications, as long as we don't vaporize our carbon.:
Depending on the gun, the mass of a bullet usually ranges between 0.02 kilograms and 0.04 kilograms. The mass of a bullet depends on the caliber and type of gun used. A bullet can be fired from a revolver, pistol, rifle, machine gun or other weapon.
So, for those that didn't pay attention to metrics, our T-shirt bullet with 0.05 Kg is above most normal bullets in weight of pure carbon. If that mass hits you at the right velocity, you're in trouble.

BUT AIR FRICTION! Doesn't matter at all, you can completely ignore air-friction, we're at this point dealing with a rough sphere of burned up carbon, sure, the resistance is going to deform it.. into its most aerodynamic shape. there's some opposing force from the air, of course, just like there is on bullets.
Now we know the velocity at which a bullet can do damage, that means, all that's left is for us is to be dense, or rather, look at the density of carbon vs lead (What bullets are primarly made off ofc), the denser a material the heavier it is per surface area, meaning the more damage I can do. We have a rounded 2 for Carbon vs an 11 for lead, or a 1 to 5.5 ratio.

So. to simplify, a 50 gramm bullet of carbon does the same damage, at the same velocity, as a lead bullet of about 9 gram weight. Can that do damage?.. Well, it's still heavier than the lighest gun shell around. So yes.

But! We are not talking average velocity, you see, the melting point of lead is only ~330 °C. Carbon is, we recall, at ten times that amount just to MELT And lead bullets do not vaporize into nothing in thin air, So, while our Carbon payload faces over five times more resistance due to it's lower density, it can handle over ten times the acceleration force without melting.
So, we're doing, at bare minimum, the same damage as 90 gram of lead, spread over a larger area of impact, but so are shotguns. Now, Shotgun shells are weighted in nonsensical nonmetric american units like gauges and grains and their weight varies heavily, but even using heavy rounds, I reckon that'd still be several@shotgungunshot 's. Completely ignoring the molten stuff coming at you, yes, this would do damage.

Now keep in mind, there are realistic objections to this, but most are waved away by Slicer stating I could use 'any means' to turn the t-shirt into a projectile, to, I presume impart Velocity, that means I can choose a barrel that wouldn't melt up itself first, I don't have to worry about the shooter and Newton's laws (aka, recoil), or the energy source used to power our higly impractical shotgun.

TL/DR: NEVER understimate the physics of energy working on objects.
And THAT'S how you refute someone! Fuckin A, I don't even want to dispute semantics. Thank you sir, I wish more of the discourse in this sub was of such quality.

Do you not know how physics works? Or how thin that skin of your scrotum is? Also, your limbs have the benefit of muscle, sinew, and bones to absorb a majority of the energy from an impact. Your crotch isn't as well-protected, bud. Something like that rope scene from Casino Royale could cause your scrotum to explode on the first swing, and that's not even going into the mutilation it might do to your shaft.
That you're equating clothing with rope is... inexplicable. What do they make shirts out of where you come from? IIRC (and to be honest I only watched the movie once) what was used was something akin to a 2" nautical rope. Not only does it have a higher density as it has been braided quite tightly it's also been treated with some solution to guard it against the elements, both of which make it far a more rigid material. Might be time to buy some new clothes, I can't imagine those rope underpants you must be wearing are very comfortable.

We're not even gonna go into how a condensed mass-no matter how soft its un-condensed state is-gains density the more you condense it. And t-shirt guns are considered a class-B firearm, so I'm gonna assume it produces enough force on discharge to do some damage if you're standing too close.

But, yeah, it's probably fake news. You're still a dumbass, though.
You need to go back to school kiddo. There is no way you're compressing a t-shirt to any meaningful degree in that open-ended barrel with compressed air. In order to do so you'd have to be imparting enough force that the atmosphere in the barrel would resist (read as: can't get out of the way fast enough) the projectile.

Maybe if instead of spending your time being a toxic presence here, you could go re-learn science? Because whoever taught you did quite the awful job.
 

Yoshiiki

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Everything is fine and dandy, but you forgot about volume issue which will impact few things, well, more like ignored since we are doing troll science here. Second will be a supersonic/near supersonic speeds and how that impacts the bullet. Third thing to include is how materials behave during impact. Projectile that has a stupidly wide spread and by stretch has low accuracy rate is pretty useless.

Also, yes, you can roll a t-shirt to enough degree and shoot it out of air cannon to make it hurt hard as fuck, depending on cloth material, you could do more damage than just punching someone. Pressurized air is released into the barrel, uncompromising and only reason things are shot out of it is because those are shitty seals. Energy is never lost.
And please, don't tell anyone to re-learn science when you are impressed by basics presented by Pervy (I'm not saying time wasn't spent in that), you were literally insulted and thanked for that.
Extra: Toxic - The pot calling the kettle black, glad you learned a buzzword. Guess that's the part of ball licking to finally get mod powers you wanted for so long.

Also, Bob, no exploding of scrotum, sorry, you are wrong. It could tear, but you are forgetting inside of your balls is not separate part like water balloon. It's more possible that your inner balls would be pushed deeper into your body, slightly crushed, tearing the ball sack and doing significant damage/pain. While mutilation would be possible, skin is actually quite sturdy, blunt damage isn't as effective against it as puncturing. Otherwise a kick to the balls would mutilate people on the go, which doesn't happen as often. Damage to the dick is another case, to do significant one it needs to be erect.

That aside

inb4 - conspiracy theories!
 
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Ninja_Named_Bob

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You need to go back to school kiddo. There is no way you're compressing a t-shirt to any meaningful degree in that open-ended barrel with compressed air. In order to do so you'd have to be imparting enough force that the atmosphere in the barrel would resist (read as: can't get out of the way fast enough) the projectile.

Maybe if instead of spending your time being a toxic presence here, you could go re-learn science? Because whoever taught you did quite the awful job.
Okay, so you only read part of the post and didn't bother reading the rest. Yeah, no, Pervy and I said basically the same thing, except he went into more detail and forgot to call you a dumbass. Here, on @Pervy's behalf, you're a dumbass. The wrestling ring rope and torture rope were just extreme examples of things that look innocuous in their existing states, but have the potential to do extreme damage. Also, telling me to go back to school when you immediately waved something off as "non-harmful" when used as a projectile is laughable.

Bud, do you not even know how much energy the t-shirt cannon has to produce for it to reach even halfway into the stands, where people would generally receive the t-shirts? You're not just firing it with the hopes it unfurls and gently descends into the mass of bodies. Before you even start throwing non-arguments, go educate yourself on how transference of energy functions. You can't just propel a t-shirt into the air with greater resistance bearing down on it than the amount of energy you would use to project it. Not even talking about the t-shirt cannon itself anymore; any firearm ever would fail hilariously if the resistance the projectile experienced via the atmosphere within the barrel exceeded its exit velocity. Oh, but let's go deeper into this.

Because you're not using a traditional gunpowder propellant, that means the source you're using to produce enough energy to sustain the exit velocity has to be powerful enough to produce the intended effect with half the risk, if that. This is a class-B firearm, sir, meaning it's likely using compressed air. Have you ever fired a Pellet gun? I'm going to assume you haven't. For the average pistol, the standard canister is 12 grams, 80 shots. Pellet guns can do some damage at close range. Your average pellet gun is standard-issue for a farmer's child up here in Leaf Land to neutralize a gopher. 12 gram-cannister of compressed carbon does that, bud.

So, we know a 12g cannister is sufficient to take out a rodent. Next, we consider barrel length and width. Let's just assume your average ABS tube averages 4in in circumference. That's a pretty damn small hole (comparatively) to put a condensed object (like a t-shirt) into. Well, let's assume the "safe" width is 6in. Our average t-shirt is probably a large, and it's generally tightly-fit into a cylindrical space and then projected high-velocity out of that space. Your average t-shirt gun has a range of 10-150ft, meaning the psi has to produce enough energy to not just push the t-shirt (in its condensed state) out of the barrel, it also has to have an exit velocity that's sustainable over a specific distance. Yeah, that doesn't look like it would hurt at all from 2-10ft away (sarcasm fully intended).

I don't need re-education, bud. You need to take these last few posts into consideration, eat some humble pie, and get off my dick about toxicity when your posts are generally the dumbest, most useless shit anyone has had the displeasure of experiencing.

Also, Bob, no exploding of scrotum, sorry, you are wrong. It could tear, but you are forgetting inside of your balls is not separate part like water balloon. It's more possible that your inner balls would be pushed deeper into your body, slightly crushed, tearing the ball sack and doing significant damage/pain. While mutilation would be possible, skin is actually quite sturdy, blunt damage isn't as effective against it as puncturing. Otherwise a kick to the balls would mutilate people on the go, which doesn't happen as often. Damage to the dick is another case, to do significant one it needs to be erect.
I mean, I'm sure after a few good swings with the torture rope or landing on the ring rope a few times, you'd notice some bruising, if nothing else. I know skin is quite sturdy (High elasticity, actually, but fuck semantics), and yeah, I was wrong on the whole "exploding scrotum" thing. More citing extremes, if nothing else.



inb4 - conspiracy theories!
You know what the most terrifying part of this is? I would believe a Fox Mulder-tier conspiracy theory about this shit at this point. It can turn on my microwave and set my clock? So, basically, if someone has it in for me and wants to fuck with my schedule and food, all they gotta do is bypass my wifi password and tell Alexa how to fuck my day up? No, thanks.

Mind, you have to buy the "custom" microwave and wall clock to get those features, but that's not very re-assuring when those will likely replace the existing non-compatible stuff in a few years, anyways.
 
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Yoshiiki

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Okay, so you only read part of the post and didn't bother reading the rest. Yeah, no, Pervy and I said basically the same thing, except he went into more detail and forgot to call you a dumbass. Here, on @Pervy's behalf, you're a dumbass. The wrestling ring rope and torture rope were just extreme examples of things that look innocuous in their existing states, but have the potential to do extreme damage. Also, telling me to go back to school when you immediately waved something off as "non-harmful" when used as a projectile is laughable.

Bud, do you not even know how much energy the t-shirt cannon has to produce for it to reach even halfway into the stands, where people would generally receive the t-shirts? You're not just firing it with the hopes it unfurls and gently descends into the mass of bodies. Before you even start throwing non-arguments, go educate yourself on how transference of energy functions. You can't just propel a t-shirt into the air with greater resistance bearing down on it than the amount of energy you would use to project it. Not even talking about the t-shirt cannon itself anymore; any firearm ever would fail hilariously if the resistance the projectile experienced via the atmosphere within the barrel exceeded its exit velocity. Oh, but let's go deeper into this.

Because you're not using a traditional gunpowder propellant, that means the source you're using to produce enough energy to sustain the exit velocity has to be powerful enough to produce the intended effect with half the risk, if that. This is a class-B firearm, sir, meaning it's likely using compressed air. Have you ever fired a Pellet gun? I'm going to assume you haven't. For the average pistol, the standard canister is 12 grams, 80 shots. Pellet guns can do some damage at close range. Your average pellet gun is standard-issue for a farmer's child up here in Leaf Land to neutralize a gopher. 12 gram-cannister of compressed carbon does that, bud.

So, we know a 12g cannister is sufficient to take out a rodent. Next, we consider barrel length and width. Let's just assume your average ABS tube averages 4in in circumference. That's a pretty damn small hole (comparatively) to put a condensed object (like a t-shirt) into. Well, let's assume the "safe" width is 6in. Our average t-shirt is probably a large, and it's generally tightly-fit into a cylindrical space and then projected high-velocity out of that space. Your average t-shirt gun has a range of 10-150ft, meaning the psi has to produce enough energy to not just push the t-shirt (in its condensed state) out of the barrel, it also has to have an exit velocity that's sustainable over a specific distance. Yeah, that doesn't look like it would hurt at all from 2-10ft away (sarcasm fully intended).
Question though. I bet it's safe to assume air cannons have compressors to get air. What about those tiny cartridges for air guns? Not all gases have same expansion rate and that's the main horsepower behind a projectile. Then again, difference could be so tiny it doesn't matter... Though, compressed air is more reliable than CO2 when it comes to ASG xD
You know what the most terrifying part of this is? I would believe a Fox Mulder-tier conspiracy theory about this shit at this point. It can turn on my microwave and set my clock? So, basically, if someone has it in for me and wants to fuck with my schedule and food, all they gotta do is bypass my wifi password and tell Alexa how to fuck my day up? No, thanks.

Mind, you have to buy the "custom" microwave and wall clock to get those features, but that's not very re-assuring when those will likely replace the existing non-compatible stuff in a few years, anyways.
Well, guns don't kill people is good analogy. It's not the tool, it's how it's used. When someone has the power to decide what is best for you, that's the point where you are fucked. Unfortunately, we do live in a world where many think they know best what is good for others, because their life either sucked or they didn't experience it. Going with analogies, parents who grew in harsh environment will try their best to make sure their children don't go through same thing.
 

Ninja_Named_Bob

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Question though. I bet it's safe to assume air cannons have compressors to get air. What about those tiny cartridges for air guns? Not all gases have same expansion rate and that's the main horsepower behind a projectile. Then again, difference could be so tiny it doesn't matter... Though, compressed air is more reliable than CO2 when it comes to ASG xD
You would be correct, so you're generally adjusting for different psi based on where you're firing. An air cannon would have that kind of thing built into it nearby the firing apparatus for convenience's sake, too. That said, while the shirt isn't going to render a man in half, taking a 30 psi shot to the dick isn't a "walk it off" kind of situation.

Well, guns don't kill people is good analogy. It's not the tool, it's how it's used. When someone has the power to decide what is best for you, that's the point where you are fucked. Unfortunately, we do live in a world where many think they know best what is good for others, because their life either sucked or they didn't experience it. Going with analogies, parents who grew in harsh environment will try their best to make sure their children don't go through same thing.
...Which is the crux of this generation, ironically. The more our parents coddled and "protected" us, the more difficult it was for this generation (Millennial's) to gain the necessary experience to go through life without throwing a fit every time something we don't want to happen, happens. Now, couple that with the rapid development of technologies to simplify life, add in some "let me spoonfeed you this information you could find on your own" a la the internet, and you have an entire generation (mostly) incapable of functioning without a machine telling them how perform the simple act of breathing.

And to bring things full circle with your analogy, "it's his fault I shot him!" Basically, you, me, and a specific portion of the population are fully aware a school shooter doesn't just obtain a semi-automatic for "good behavior", and sure as Hell isn't going to be prevented from doing so if you get stricter about owning a firearm. Situation here isn't the same, mind you. In this instance, Alexa is being given so much control over my home at this point that not being concerned about it seems a bit naive. One could even argue I'm begging to have something go wrong.
 

Yoshiiki

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You would be correct, so you're generally adjusting for different psi based on where you're firing. An air cannon would have that kind of thing built into it nearby the firing apparatus for convenience's sake, too. That said, while the shirt isn't going to render a man in half, taking a 30 psi shot to the dick isn't a "walk it off" kind of situation.
...Which is the crux of this generation, ironically. The more our parents coddled and "protected" us, the more difficult it was for this generation (Millennial's) to gain the necessary experience to go through life without throwing a fit every time something we don't want to happen, happens. Now, couple that with the rapid development of technologies to simplify life, add in some "let me spoonfeed you this information you could find on your own" a la the internet, and you have an entire generation (mostly) incapable of functioning without a machine telling them how perform the simple act of breathing.
Oh yeah, millennials are mainly generation of whiny bitches... That being said, boomers aren't better either, bunch of damn hippies. But, keep in mind how long kids stay until they fuck off to their own houses, that time of incubation also does it's thing. One thing though, while someone may by a spoiled brat by mommy and daddy, in the very end, only person responsible is one in the mirror.
Yet, I do not exactly mind that... Because when it comes to relationship, guys like that learn quite fast that most women want a man, not an emotional princess. One thing I learned when doing trips to different countries as wimps/incels are a rare sight here.
And to bring things full circle with your analogy, "it's his fault I shot him!" Basically, you, me, and a specific portion of the population are fully aware a school shooter doesn't just obtain a semi-automatic for "good behavior", and sure as Hell isn't going to be prevented from doing so if you get stricter about owning a firearm. Situation here isn't the same, mind you. In this instance, Alexa is being given so much control over my home at this point that not being concerned about it seems a bit naive. One could even argue I'm begging to have something go wrong.
Well, to lower number of school shooters media needs to stop giving them such exposure... since it won't happen, they should at least shame and ridicule them. Not many wants to be remembered as "that one dumb faggot bitch that shoot someone because he needed to throw a fit like 5 year old".
Kek, if you want to be paranoid, you can always secure old style equipment and learn about electronics. It's not that complicated and most kitchen stuff is really simple. I generally don't buy new stuff when costs of time and materials to fix it are stupidly low.
Also, since many things are build in modular way to save on time and other stuff, it's not that complicated to physically disconnect a part on the board and use it as a accessory to that tinfoil hat xD
 

Pervy

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I'm not sure if Yoshi was adressing me, so I'll just roll in on it.
Everything is fine and dandy, but you forgot about volume issue which will impact few things,
Volume did actually worry me the most too, so I had to read up on things again there and, suprisingly, it turns out that volume is not that large a factor, basically, it's the kilo of lead vs kilo of feathers, which is heavier problem, because, again, the energy I can input is by any means, so almost arbitrarily large. The energy to get going is far greater, yes, but that's why I lowballed my numbers to be safe. We don't want efficent, we want working.

Second will be a supersonic/near supersonic speeds and how that impacts the bullet.
What do you mean? I already did the calculations on that. Once an object is in motion, say it with me Newton-fans,.. that's right, it remains in motion and beyond fluid-friction there's little difference for the object itself if you move at ten or ten thousand km/h.

Projectile that has a stupidly wide spread and by stretch has low accuracy rate is pretty useless.
Hence me likening it to a shotgun, low range, high area damage, crappy accuracy. But I didn't need to demonstrate greater range than the mascot had, presumably.

And please, don't tell anyone to re-learn science when you are impressed by basics presented by Pervy (I'm not saying time wasn't spent in that), you were literally insulted and thanked for that.
This, is why I continue to express my respect for Slicer over you, you are both about as.. expressive, but Slicer shows maturity in accepting being wrong on a concept. I also kind of doubt that this was a super important point of contention for old Slicer. *chuckles*
Nothing I wrote was ment as an insult to his character and I apogize if it was percieved as such, it was merely a mental exercise, like a cross-word, for others.
I actually started this whole post believing I could be wrong, though I had a strong innate inkling about it.
I'd also dispute you on the fact that I used only the bare basics, and infact, would postulate that by giving away you believe I only used basics speaks more to your than to my understanding.

While what I did post -was- very basics indeed, some of the considerations behind it were not and I consider the ability to simplify a problem and allow it to be at least somewhat followed along by someone that is not familiar with the underlying concepts a greater sign of understanding than, for example, posting the formula for drag-resistance, putting in all the variables instead of those fanciful greek letters and then calling Slicer a n00b at the end. But different strokes, different folks.

-----

For the record, The idea of compressing the T-shirt strikes me as odd.
To find out if something is a good idea in theory, take it to its extreme. Let's say you could somehow infinitely condense the T-Shirt. (well not.. true infinity, that'd get us a singularity, a tiny black hole that'd decay and ..to be fair, do some serious damage if you stand too cose.. but infinite within reason).

Now. Theoretically you could compress the T-shirt so much that the Carbon contained within becomes a diamond, problem with that it's basically my approach of super high velocity with a needless added step. A diamond only increases the density to 3.5 vs a 2.2 from carbon, and, to take Slicer's idea fairly, I'd say you are not allowed to increase your amount of T-Shirts beyond what a normal T-shirt gun would fire in a single shot.
BUT! Diamonds.. your perfect compression, keep in mind.. are incredibly brittle.

What the fuck is that, you say, I heard Diamonds are incredibly hard!

Well, turns out, materials have different properties. Basically, have you tried breaking a stick and tearing a piece of paper? Easy! But now what if I told you to break a piece of paper and tear a stick. Yeap, it's kinda like that. Diamond happens to be very hard, but exactly that makes it exeptionally brittle as well. I'm no expert at the shooting of the things, but I'd not be suprised if a solid diamond bullet, besides being expensive, would shatter in the barrel.

The more you condense your T-shirt, the more brittle it'll become. This matters because, in this example our Velocity is the same, so if we compress our object too much, it has time to shatter, on exit or even impact, before it can impart enough energy (imparting energy is physics for doing the damage).
So, compression could help but is not the answer, I'd expect a bell-curve distribution of usefulness of compression vs resistance of the material, where some compression is helpful, but would not put the damage potential of the T-shirt above a literal, optimized potatoe gun.
 
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Yoshiiki

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I'm not sure if Yoshi was adressing me, so I'll just roll in on it.


Volume did actually worry me the most too, so I had to read up on things again there and, suprisingly, it turns out that volume is not that large a factor, basically, it's the kilo of lead vs kilo of feathers, which is heavier problem, because, again, the energy I can input is by any means, so almost arbitrarily large. The energy to get going is far greater, yes, but that's why I lowballed my numbers to be safe. We don't want efficent, we want working.

What do you mean? I already did the calculations on that. Once an object is in motion, say it with me Newton-fans,.. that's right, it remains in motion and beyond fluid-friction there's little difference for the object itself if you move at ten or ten thousand km/h.
Energy is not wasted, but behavior of objects during super sonic or near super sonic speeds is different. A bullet going straight will be more accurate than cylinder tumbling into more or less target's direction. Also, we can't forget about Planck's discovery that also is in effect here. Not all materials will hold themselves in those speeds. Try wooden bullets for example. Since it's not exactly elementary issue, I am not beating you on that... however...
Hence me likening it to a shotgun, low range, high area damage, crappy accuracy. But I didn't need to demonstrate greater range than the mascot had, presumably.
Real life is not Call of Duty. Just wait for someone who handled guns to give to you lengthy explanation. There is more than one ammo type. Please go visit gun range and play with some guns, you will learn about this myth being kinda fake after getting instructor explanation. Again, it's popular myth created by games, so it's fine for falling for it, doesn't make it correct.
This, is why I continue to express my respect for Slicer over you, you are both about as.. expressive, but Slicer shows maturity in accepting being wrong on a concept. I also kind of doubt that this was a super important point of contention for old Slicer. *chuckles*
Don't even try starting it. Do I have to remind you that your default action for proving you wrong on little, unimportant crap no one cares about was to close the thread? This is also the problem with you guys. I do not care about my online persona, with a fling of a dick in less than 5 minutes I can make new one. This is how much it's worth - nothing. Neither I care of it for others... Doesn't mean I can't laugh at it.
Nothing I wrote was ment as an insult to his character and I apogize if it was percieved as such, it was merely a mental exercise, like a cross-word, for others.
Weird typos... seems like a bait (but does it actually?), going to ignore. No, you did not insult him, I never said you did, it was self-harm.
I actually started this whole post believing I could be wrong, though I had a strong innate inkling about it.
I'd also dispute you on the fact that I used only the bare basics, and infact, would postulate that by giving away you believe I only used basics speaks more to your than to my understanding.
Those are bare basics, anyone can use google and basic math to achieve the same. However, we are assuming educational system is on equal level everywhere. I don't think I need to ask if you know where I am going with it and with what stereotype I am laughing at right now. It's related to words dumb and americans.
While what I did post -was- very basics indeed, some of the considerations behind it were not and I consider the ability to simplify a problem and allow it to be at least somewhat followed along by someone that is not familiar with the underlying concepts a greater sign of understanding than, for example, posting the formula for drag-resistance, putting in all the variables instead of those fanciful greek letters and then calling Slicer a n00b at the end. But different strokes, different folks.
If you understand something - good, if you actually understand it to be able to put in simple form for others to understand - better. There is a good reason why I don't try to over complicate what I write, I would rather have everyone to get it than only few. Thus, tons of simple analogies in my posts, gets the job done. Still, I am also a dick, so I won't write simple "I agree" just like I could do now, not as much fun in that :^)
For the record, The idea of compressing the T-shirt strikes me as odd.
To find out if something is a good idea in theory, take it to its extreme. Let's say you could somehow infinitely condense the T-Shirt. (well not.. true infinity, that'd get us a singularity, a tiny black hole that'd decay and ..to be fair, do some serious damage if you stand too cose.. but infinite within reason).
You don't need to go to extremes, just simple few tonne press will be enough to turn simple T-shirt into hard blank that you can hit someone with. Then we can go into dumb semantics and argue that stuffing shirt into an air cannon barrel is already a compression. Or even if using a stupid press isn't an extreme.
Now. Theoretically you could compress the T-shirt so much that the Carbon contained within becomes a diamond, problem with that it's basically my approach of super high velocity with a needless added step. A diamond only increases the density to 3.5 vs a 2.2 from carbon, and, to take Slicer's idea fairly, I'd say you are not allowed to increase your amount of T-Shirts beyond what a normal T-shirt gun would fire in a single shot.
BUT! Diamonds.. your perfect compression, keep in mind.. are incredibly brittle.
You know, I am going through a post sentence by sentence. You are now starting to point into what I already mentioned in first quote response.
What the fuck is that, you say, I heard Diamonds are incredibly hard!

Well, turns out, materials have different properties. Basically, have you tried breaking a stick and tearing a piece of paper? Easy! But now what if I told you to break a piece of paper and tear a stick. Yeap, it's kinda like that. Diamond happens to be very hard, but exactly that makes it exeptionally brittle as well. I'm no expert at the shooting of the things, but I'd not be suprised if a solid diamond bullet, besides being expensive, would shatter in the barrel.
Doesn't need to be in the barrel. Go check what Planck discovered. This is why I mentioned super sonic speeds earlier. Again, I am a dick and like having fun.
The more you condense your T-shirt, the more brittle it'll become. This matters because, in this example our Velocity is the same, so if we compress our object too much, it has time to shatter, on exit or even impact, before it can impart enough energy (imparting energy is physics for doing the damage).
So, compression could help but is not the answer, I'd expect a bell-curve distribution of usefulness of compression vs resistance of the material, where some compression is helpful, but would not put the damage potential of the T-shirt above a literal, optimized potatoe gun.
You are giving too much thought into gas expansion in the barrel. Wooden bullet could safely exit a barrel and shatter mid flight. If we were playing a game, I would be saying "hot, hot!". The thing is, you would be right on track, but since blinded, you wouldn't see that huge crevice and fall right into it. Did I mention I am a dick?
 

Pervy

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This is also the problem with you guys. I do not care about my online persona, with a fling of a dick in less than 5 minutes I can make new one. This is how much it's worth - nothing. Neither I care of it for others... Doesn't mean I can't laugh at it.
You see, nearly the same effort goes into being polite and rude. I merely find it more pleasant to engage people politely. If they pay me back in kind, wonderful. I'm saying that you talk/write a lot for someone that doesn't care.
I mean, I get why you do it too, I went through a similiar phase when I was young. It gets better though, promise.
That said, the side effect of not minding your manners for too long is that you use up my patience and more importantly any goodwill to engage with you, so be a good boy and give this topic back to whatever random news people want to post, I ain't splitting hairs on this.
 

Yoshiiki

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You see, nearly the same effort goes into being polite and rude. I merely find it more pleasant to engage people politely. If they pay me back in kind, wonderful. I'm saying that you talk/write a lot for someone that doesn't care.
I mean, I get why you do it too, I went through a similiar phase when I was young. It gets better though, promise.
That said, the side effect of not minding your manners for too long is that you use up my patience and more importantly any goodwill to engage with you, so be a good boy and give this topic back to whatever random news people want to post, I ain't splitting hairs on this.
Timmy, you do not get it. But this is what I am talking about, you got tipped off by shotgun comment, as it undermines a lot what you said. You can't handle being wrong or fucking up.
I care about discussions and facts, other person being nice, a dick, male, female, gay, straight, doesn't matter or who they are on the internet does not matter. I can call someone a dumb idiot and agree with something later. Give credit where credit is due, laugh when it's laughable. Only reason you didn't got laughing treatment is because you looked into stuff and that means showing interest, Jimmy.
Again, no one really gives two fucks about your goodwill, it's not important, you are only person who cares, no one else does, have a little more shame. You may not be important, but you do have a voice, don't waste it like that.
I do however like the irony: "but Slicer shows maturity in accepting being wrong on a concept.", meaning, you aren't very mature by your own words, kiddo.

That being said, fee fees took over actual talking points and it goes nowhere as always. Next time consider having a little more shame and accepting screwing up on the topics you aren't that familiar with. Sure, it takes a lot to accept a fuckup sometimes, but it's better than trying to save that fake persona mask everyone can see right through.
For those that didn't understand: This is what happens when you put yourself in a bubble, surround with "yes-men" and/or people that share only same views. While it is nice, when reality knocks on the door, she ain't playing around.

Anyway, since this just popped out in my feed.



I don't think it finally reached it's tipping point, but stirring it like that won't end nicely.
inb4 It's USA fault for starting it in the first place/Shouldn't remove those dictators
Yes and no. Yes for the fact it wouldn't grow as much without USA intervention. No, because it could have been executed much better in the first place.
 
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super_slicer

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Okay, so you only read part of the post and didn't bother reading the rest. Yeah, no, Pervy and I said basically the same thing, except he went into more detail and forgot to call you a dumbass. Here, on @Pervy's behalf, you're a dumbass.
Well, seeing as pervy was creating a thought project within the bounds of my vague statement:
I'm not even sure you could turn a shirt into a projectile worthy of the name with any means, as at some velocity friction within the chamber would cause enough heat to atomize cloth.
Going so far as to reduce the shirt to it's atoms (honestly he could have just wrapped it around a canonball if he was really lazy) and sling them through god knows what sort of acceleration device.

Whereas you're trying to convince me a t-shirt gun can cause egregious harm. While you may be attempting to use the same principles, you are decidedly not saying the same thing.
 

Yoshiiki

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Well, seeing as pervy was creating a thought project within the bounds of my vague statement:

Going so far as to reduce the shirt to it's atoms (honestly he could have just wrapped it around a canonball if he was really lazy) and sling them through god knows what sort of acceleration device.

Whereas you're trying to convince me a t-shirt gun can cause egregious harm. While you may be attempting to use the same principles, you are decidedly not saying the same thing.
Correct, they weren't exactly on same page here. Pervy went into extremes and did check on the topic, there are still issues but it's a good starting point.
Bobbo stayed within actual possible reality... more or less.
To put it into perspective:
gun - safely above 2700 joules of energy
human punch - 300-700 joules of energy
Air gun - could easily produce 1500 joules of energy
Most air guns are limited by law. ASG with limit of 20 joules during pellet barrel release will be enough to hurt and leave a mark. Now, instead of 6mm plastic ball, you have a rolled up shirt doing the same. It would be similar to stepping on a rake like in dumb cartoons. Since it's hitting you in the balls, it will hurt much more than being hit in the arm, stomach or face.
Now, if you want some math. T-shirt weighs around 135g, if we assume it has 300m/s, then that shirt will hit you with 400 joules of energy. In reality, it will probably be much more, but I am limiting it to 300m/s because most ASG don't go above that. Even with only that... 400 joules, how much is a punch by averages?
 

Ninja_Named_Bob

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@Yoshiiki: It's a really tricky topic, US involvement in foreign affairs. On the one hand, they haven't won a war since their own Civil War, and that's more a pyrrhic victory when you consider what was lost. They didn't get too involved in WWI (if at all), and WWII was more a "Seriously, Japan?" than actual contributions. Common misconception with this generation and idiots is that they "Fuck Yeah'd!" across Europe when, in fact, it was mostly Russia. US didn't even really enter the theater until near the end, when, again, Japan decided to start shit. Suffice it to say, that ended badly for the latter.

In terms of the US doing more harm than good, again, it's a mixed bag. Most of the time, their idea of "helping out" is establishing a government and/or policies that benefits them. The CIA and other assorted agencies have a habit of doing shit without any real long-term planning. Operation Desert Storm comes to mind, among others.

So, yeah, US intervention is a mixed bag and any effort to really reconcile their past... mistakes generally blows up in their face. On the upside, at least they have the world's largest/most powerful navy?

@Slicer: I can't add to what Yoshiiki has already stated, but imagine getting punched in the dick. Average punch is probs around 500 joules if we're being generous, so multiple punches to the dick is probably not healthy. Also, I already pointed out my first post about ball-busting included extremes. I shouldn't have to say something for you twice.
 
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