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Discussion - why I think hentai games often get pirated and potential solution


Hagya

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Re: Discussion - why I think hentai games often get pirated and potential solution

The delayed free version we see on most patreon supported H games kinda works but I think the only thing keeping it working is the unspoken agreement this community has to not pirate games made by devs within the community. It probably can't last if the community grows large enough.
I use the delayed free version method and I'm not sure about this agreement. I've got plenty of "patrons" that pledge $1 to get access to the patron version and remove their pledge immediately after (before being charged). They do it to avoid paying $1 or to avoid waiting for 2 weeks... Hopefully, this will be solved by the patreon staff once they add the "upfront charging". This feature should be available in 3 or 4 months.
I also got my patron version uploaded to some flash websites before the public release but now my games is site-locked so this problem is pretty much solved. It could also be uploaded to torrent websites but I'm far from being as known as akabur so I guess nobody bother to do it.
 

rtkamb

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Re: Discussion - why I think hentai games often get pirated and potential solution

Now that I think about it, I think most of the "I only pirate because ..." posts are really just excuses. You'd pirate regardless. I admit, I would too. I only buy games that I want to get immediately rather than wait for the pirates to share. Somebody earlier in the thread said that 97% of people surveyed said they'd pirate if given the choice.

That's the unfortunate reality. People pirate because they can. There are no consequences, they aren't directly harming the dev (unless they actively distribute it), so they don't really care.

It's not like people should be blamed for it. It just means that the business model isn't viable. That holds true for games in general which is why recently we have seen new business models that include a free option.

The delayed free version we see on most patreon supported H games kinda works but I think the only thing keeping it working is the unspoken agreement this community has to not pirate games made by devs within the community. It probably can't last if the community grows large enough.
This may come out weird, but people shouldn't be buying them for a reason.

Last time I checked it was illegal in America, don't know about other country's, to own rape, underage, or bestiality (and there's probably more, I'm not a lawyer). That makes every game (I think) that I have played illegal for me to own. As much as I, or others, want to help the developer by giving them our money, we can not. I'm not about to leave a paper trail, and have the cops knocking on my door about purchasing some loli rape game that I thought was fantastic.
 

Balmunk Fezarion

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Re: Discussion - why I think hentai games often get pirated and potential solution

This may come out weird, but people shouldn't be buying them for a reason.

Last time I checked it was illegal in America, don't know about other country's, to own rape, underage, or bestiality (and there's probably more, I'm not a lawyer). That makes every game (I think) that I have played illegal for me to own. As much as I, or others, want to help the developer by giving them our money, we can not. I'm not about to leave a paper trail, and have the cops knocking on my door about purchasing some loli rape game that I thought was fantastic.
Double negative makes a positive right?

It is illegal to own those games, therefore if you obtain something illegal in an illegal way, it should make it legal!

It is not like playing a loli rape game is a basic human right or basic need something. If you are not allowed to own it then don't own it. No means no, if something is legally unobtainable doesn't mean you are entitled to obtain it illegally. Weed is illegal in a lot of countries, doesn't make buying weed from dealers rightful.
 

rtkamb

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Re: Discussion - why I think hentai games often get pirated and potential solution

Double negative makes a positive right?

It is illegal to own those games, therefore if you obtain something illegal in an illegal way, it should make it legal!

It is not like playing a loli rape game is a basic human right or basic need something. If you are not allowed to own it then don't own it. No means no, if something is legally unobtainable doesn't mean you are entitled to obtain it illegally. Weed is illegal in a lot of countries, doesn't make buying weed from dealers rightful.
Your trolling hard, I never once said that I was doing something legal, I just don't think it's a smart idea to leave a paper trail when you do something illegal.

If this conversation goes on much longer, I think your in the wrong forum. This place is all about what you disagree with.
 

Omnikuken

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Re: Discussion - why I think hentai games often get pirated and potential solution

This may come out weird, but people shouldn't be buying them for a reason.

Last time I checked it was illegal in America, don't know about other country's, to own rape, underage, or bestiality (and there's probably more, I'm not a lawyer). That makes every game (I think) that I have played illegal for me to own. As much as I, or others, want to help the developer by giving them our money, we can not. I'm not about to leave a paper trail, and have the cops knocking on my door about purchasing some loli rape game that I thought was fantastic.
I REALLY doubt the police/FBI/CIA/MIB will come knocking on someone's door cause they bought a loli game on Dlsite ....... Otherwise, it would be all over the news and Dlsite would either close off the english side or put a huge warning : Don't purchase here if you live in Murica .....

Said police/agencies already have trouble enforcing "real" child porn/abuse laws, I think they won't bother and/or waste their time on H-stuff.

Now, not trying to play devil's advocate, but I'd bet a lot that you won't ever get in trouble for playing a game like this, epic price/loli-fest not-withstanding.
 
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erobotan

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Re: Discussion - why I think hentai games often get pirated and potential solution

there is a visual novel where you play as a loli to have sex with another girl (i forget if this girl is a teen or also a loli). It's in STEAM and UNCENSORED
 
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goduranus

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Re: Discussion - why I think hentai games often get pirated and potential solution

What if sexual content were added to normal games, much like sex scenes were used to enhance Game of Thrones and House of Cards?

Grand Theft Auto already has some of this and it'd be cool to see it expanded to other games.

I would love to see hentai Terraria or hentai Starbound, where plenty of underground monsters provide hentai opportunites.

Or hentai Diablo with demons, or hentai Planet Explorers with aliens or some kind of hentai Dead Space with tentacular necromorphs.
 

Angmir

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Re: Discussion - why I think hentai games often get pirated and potential solution

Disscusion about Piracy on forum providing thousands of download links to Japananese Games ....

Porn should be free

People should support creators they want optionaly in apreaciation gesture.

Reward should be proportional to quality of the product.

Creator unable to get enough willing contributors for things they do, and instead choose to charge few patrons they have with huge fees for tiny updates, are eighter not good enough, or should rethink their bussiness strategy.

Good game will get thousands of suporters even if it is free.

Everyone can try erning money of their works in diffrent ways - adverts, etc.


But I know all my arguments will be hollow, as people will not resign from easy money that is charging people 10$ for 5 minutes of gameplay per update ...
 

Angmir

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Re: Discussion - why I think hentai games often get pirated and potential solution

What if sexual content were added to normal games, much like sex scenes were used to enhance Game of Thrones and House of Cards?

Grand Theft Auto already has some of this and it'd be cool to see it expanded to other games.

I would love to see hentai Terraria or hentai Starbound, where plenty of underground monsters provide hentai opportunites.

Or hentai Diablo with demons, or hentai Planet Explorers with aliens or some kind of hentai Dead Space with tentacular necromorphs.
I dream of the world where there is no border between mainstream games and movies, and "adult" games and Movies.

In ideal world each movie and game that could have adult content that fits the strory should have it.
Witcher 3 is good example of that - but not good enough - sex scenes there are some sort of "reward", and it should be something that is indistinguishable from normal activities in the game.

On the other hand - we need more Story and Quality in Porn games and movies.

Porn isnt so good when 99% of screentime is dick going in and out of pussy.

I love some Japanese JAVs for that - they have story, actors perform like they are living their normal lifes, and it is focused on emotions, and circumstances - not silly - "lets fuck" like in American Porn.

There is shame, lust, embarasment, romance etc.

I often like watching the scenes in between the sex scenes in this videos more than actual penetration action - which i watch very briefly.
 

HentaiWriter

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Re: Discussion - why I think hentai games often get pirated and potential solution

What if sexual content were added to normal games, much like sex scenes were used to enhance Game of Thrones and House of Cards?
In ideal world each movie and game that could have adult content that fits the story should have it... and it should be something that is indistinguishable from normal activities in the game.
On the other hand - we need more Story and Quality in Porn games and movies.
I love some Japanese JAVs for that - they have story, actors perform like they are living their normal lives, and it is focused on emotions, and circumstances... there is shame, lust, embarrassment, romance etc.
^ All of this is EXACTLY what I'd like to see happen.

We're trying to do that with the games we're working on, and I'm sure a good deal of other western h-game devs are doing the same thing, so slowly, but surely, you should see more and more of this type of content.
 
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Tokuren

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Re: Discussion - why I think hentai games often get pirated and potential solution

They're super niche.
 
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Anckagalon

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Re: Discussion - why I think hentai games often get pirated and potential solution

I'm from Latin America, here piracy is very common. I really cannot say much about japanese developers, but i really think we can support developers from this site of the world, great examples of really amazing games are sourjelly, dotslave, Alibi(don't know exactly where he is), vosmug, grimhelm, niicri, kyrieru, menztudio, erobotan, all of them make really good games

I really think piracy never stops, but we can have quality games if we directly support western creators that can bring us UNCENSORED GAMES, in case of japanese games sadly, most of them are really bad RPGs, or very boring action games, they need a platformes and kimochi was great but i think was not the right time for that.
 

Jesus

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Re: Discussion - why I think hentai games often get pirated and potential solution

I'm from Latin America, here piracy is very common. I really cannot say much about japanese developers, but i really think we can support developers from this site of the world, great examples of really amazing games are sourjelly, dotslave, Alibi(don't know exactly where he is), vosmug, grimhelm, niicri, kyrieru, menztudio, erobotan, all of them make really good games

I really think piracy never stops, but we can have quality games if we directly support western creators that can bring us UNCENSORED GAMES, in case of japanese games sadly, most of them are really bad RPGs, or very boring action games, they need a platformes and kimochi was great but i think was not the right time for that.
I thought dotslave was from ROK?
 

HentaiWriter

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Re: Discussion - why I think hentai games often get pirated and potential solution

I'm from Latin America, here piracy is very common. I really cannot say much about japanese developers, but i really think we can support developers from this site of the world, great examples of really amazing games are sourjelly, dotslave, Alibi(don't know exactly where he is), vosmug, grimhelm, niicri, kyrieru, menztudio, erobotan, all of them make really good games
This actually brings up a good point; there's a lot of people known for western games that don't actually live in western countries, or are working with people that aren't in western countries.
(This isn't meant as a dig or a negative thing, I'm doing the same thing!)

So that said, what exactly defines "a western game"?

Is it the location of the people making it? If so, what about teams with people in multiple countries, especially if some are eastern and some are western based geographically?
Is it the language in the game? If so, what does that make games with multiple language options at sale?
Is it the art style? If so, then what about games made with a style that doesn't quite fit "anime" or "comic book" style, or even games done in 3D?

etc.
 

Anckagalon

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Re: Discussion - why I think hentai games often get pirated and potential solution

that's true i don't know if all of them are in americas but at least they're not japanese or something, and can develop uncensored material.

I don't know how much money or what requires to play games on a server, like dota, lol or starcraft, but that could it be an option to stop piracy, i'm just talking for western games or not japanese games.

seiously if i have the money to do that i'll do it, not for make money for me, just for the community, to play more quality games.

PD: sry if my english is bad, i'm out of practice.
 

CrazyPerson

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Re: Discussion - why I think hentai games often get pirated and potential solution

I agree with a lot of this thread. Rephrasing some points made elsewhere in my words:

Beware of statistics involving piracy: "would pirate the game given the chance" and "would buy the game given the chance" are only partially overlapping sets of people, usually you'd expect most of the people who pirate something "for free" to just do something else rather than spend their money buying it instead, if pirating were not an option.

Culture also plays a large role: Questionable legality, and just general "culturally frowned upon"ness causes people to be sneaky, and an anonymous torrent feels more sneaky. Also, there's the related post-masturbation shock problem: If you're in "wtf did I just jerk off to" mode, it's a lot easier and comfortable to delete a throwaway downloads folder than something that might cost money to replace.

Though I'd urge people to avoid the "porn just is free on the internet these days" argument: From what I've seen in traditional video porn, this is mostly pushed by a surprisingly ubiquitous monopoly, who use it to gut competition - and it leads to shady business practices, poor treatment of workers, and general samey one-size-fits-all low-quality-lower-price products: You don't actually all want cheerleader porn, but it's easier to mass-produce, so it's marketed such that you think you want it. Also, customer loyalty is a much bigger issue when you have paying customers rather than ad-impression eyeballs, so people are more likely to care about quality when money gets involved.
I'd expect some of these concepts translate quite well to more digital-art forms.

Ideally, I figure some of these issues can be fixed by pay-what-you-can/donation models like patreon: If you don't require everyone to pay the same, you'll get less money from some, but others will pay more instead. Unfortunately, it may lead to a wildly unpredictable income, which isn't great when you're trying to pay a mortgage and put food on the table. Then again, as said in webcomics: "Now 1000 people would each have to decide to fire me for me to lose my job..."
And it doesn't excuse independent creators from managing funds: It's not the internet's responsibility to fund future projects, it's the creator's responsibility to manage time and money such that there's a new product ready before the old one dries up, and to keep enough rainy day savings to absorb the occasional flop when a product didn't work out as expected: These will happen periodically in creative work - the only way to avoid those is to keep re-hashing the same ideas with no innovation, which leads to even more certain death.

Overall, I don't have a clear recommendation what model creators should do, though. You do what you like best! I mildly prefer things that have a polite "if you got this for free and like it, here's how you can throw money at me" messages over DRM, but I figure both have their uses.
 
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Re: Discussion - why I think hentai games often get pirated and potential solution

I pay for games from circles that have a track record of being worth my money (although 2990 has been burning me).
 

Anckagalon

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Re: Discussion - why I think hentai games often get pirated and potential solution

I almost forgot to name in my opinion, the best developer of hentai flash games, Gorepeat, his games had history, awesome gameplay, simple art but hot as hell, challenging, just awesome games, we must support developers like him.
 

Drix

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Re: Discussion - why I think hentai games often get pirated and potential solution

So that said, what exactly defines "a western game"?
The language English.
It's also the reason why the western counterpart to Japanese VNs is OEVNs - Original English Visual Novels.
 

HentaiWriter

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Re: Discussion - why I think hentai games often get pirated and potential solution

that's true i don't know if all of them are in americas but at least they're not japanese or something, and can develop uncensored material.
This is probably the biggest factor(s) that determines if something is "western" or "japanese";

1) What laws they have in regards to what's in the porn games (westerners are technically at a greater risk of getting nailed by the law if they have loli or bestiality in their games, hence why places like hentaifoundry and ge-hentai have banned such content)

2) If they have to censor their games overall or not (westerners don't have to censor stuff unless it's sold on DLSite or another japanese site, whereas easterners have to do it period)

it's the creator's responsibility to manage time and money such that there's a new product ready before the old one dries up, and to keep enough rainy day savings to absorb the occasional flop when a product didn't work out as expected: These will happen periodically in creative work - the only way to avoid those is to keep re-hashing the same ideas with no innovation, which leads to even more certain death.
Sadly, there are a lot of people both in and out of hentai that go this route of just rehashing what they did in game #1 with game #2-3-4-5 etc. with little to no changes, but this doesn't mean that everyone does.

People can thrive and even do BETTER than those rehashing things if they continually up the ante and bring something new to the table with each game.

The language English.
It's also the reason why the western counterpart to Japanese VNs is OEVNs - Original English Visual Novels.
So if I translate a game I'm working on into Japanese, English, French, Portuguese, so forth, then is it western or eastern?
 
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