VN/TEXT RPG Active NTR [Makura cover soft] Dungeon and Bride

[A Lost Cat]

Hmm, maybe. I just checked - a sorcerer (sylph) with 40 intellect (with a ring and 30 without) has 8 combat magic slots against 7 for a bard (gnome) with 23 intellect. Both are level 20. But the dependence is somehow not obvious.

There is also a possibility that some classes get less spellslots, especially two-type casters get slower spell-level learning progression even with high stats. I'm pretty sure the game is treating classes like valkyrie and monk as "half casters" like D&D does, and they get slower progression (often starting with no levels and only starting to get them at like lv5-8 or whatever, i can't remember. Bard could be one of those.

But more slots also seem to be ablke to be gained if you buy spells early, and learn them that way, one time i had someone snag a high spell very early, but nothing between, and i got more spellslots on the higher spell before the ones in lower tiers caught up, it was kindof odd.

-=-

On another note, after doing a handful of rounds of leveling that group i mentioned before to check race vs class stat gain, i think it's actually just random, so savescumming for stats could be viable, but probably isn't necessarry in any fashion unless you want to class-change quicker. The dwarf didn't get more str often, or anything. Also i lost my data on it twice due to power outages. bleh.

 

[SoulLess Child]

Hmm, maybe. I just checked - a sorcerer (sylph) with 40 intellect (with a ring and 30 without) has 8 combat magic slots against 7 for a bard (gnome) with 23 intellect. Both are level 20. But the dependence is somehow not obvious.

There is also a possibility that some classes get less spellslots, especially two-type casters get slower spell-level learning progression even with high stats. I'm pretty sure the game is treating classes like valkyrie and monk as "half casters" like D&D does, and they get slower progression (often starting with no levels and only starting to get them at like lv5-8 or whatever, i can't remember. Bard could be one of those.

But more slots also seem to be ablke to be gained if you buy spells early, and learn them that way, one time i had someone snag a high spell very early, but nothing between, and i got more spellslots on the higher spell before the ones in lower tiers caught up, it was kindof odd.

Come to think of it, in D&D and derivatives, different casting classes use different casting stats, could it be the case here?

 

[A Lost Cat]

Come to think of it, in D&D and derivatives, different casting classes use different casting stats, could it be the case here?

Oh certainly, the requirements for each class makes perfect sense for the spell types they learn, and i'm reasonably sure it matches up to them getting spells and slots, but i'm also decently sure each double-type caster has a main and a sub spell type, since they always seem to advance a little faster in one over the other, even if the class name doesn't make as much sense, such as Druid being both priest and alchemy? it feels like a reach that in D&D druids are 'divine' casters who don't need to learn spells, but also have a lot of nature oriented magic that wizards don't get access to, which would be mage-magic in here.

Obviously, the priest casters (cleric, bishop, druid, valkyrie, monk, & lord) have wisdom requirements (11, 15, 12, 11, 11, 13, respectively),
while mage casters (wizard, bishop, bard, sorcerer, & dervish) have intelligence requirements (11, 15, 11, 15, 12, respectively),
But alchemy casters (alchemist, druid, sorcerer, & assassin) also use intelligence (13, 12, 15, 14, respectively)

ones that cover priest and either of the other types, have both stat requirements, which is just bishop or druid.

Summoning doesn't seem to rely on any stat, and more depends on how early you get the summons of any particular tier, so getting more summon slots kindof hinges on getting to those places and beating that enemy at a lower level. Even if the only class that can even get summons beyond the slime has a wisdom req.

 

[ChupacabraGonzales]

Come to think of it, in D&D and derivatives, different casting classes use different casting stats, could it be the case here?

No, each stat has its own specific effect.

 

[KillerDxD]

Kinda out of the loop since version 2.06, is the trial version transferred over to the product version after the temple?

 

[ChupacabraGonzales]

Kinda out of the loop since version 2.06, is the trial version transferred over to the product version after the temple?

I mean what's the point of not starting over in the final release version? The prologue in the trial version is incomplete and skips a lot of scenes and events. (the ones that get summarized by narration)

 

[Xebit]

Oh certainly, the requirements for each class makes perfect sense for the spell types they learn, and i'm reasonably sure it matches up to them getting spells and slots, but i'm also decently sure each double-type caster has a main and a sub spell type, since they always seem to advance a little faster in one over the other

I actually looked into this after the talk about classes before.

The deductions here are on the money. Spell slots, and spells for non-summoners, are gained on level up for any spell level the job has access to naturally, if their casting stat is above a certain threshold. That's Intelligence (internal name intellect) for Mages and Alchemists; and Faith (internal name piety) for Priests and Summoners.

Spellbooks give a free spell slot on learn.
Intelligence feeds into appraisal chance, so that's the main benefit of that ring while we don't have spell damage scaling for casters.
Stat gain is a fixed 0.5 chance regardless of stat, job and race, which doesn't really make sense.


As speculated, Assassin, Lord etc are basically half casters. The three dedicated casters are rank A, the three dual casters are rank C, everything else is rank B.

Spoiler: You'd be able to work this out from the game itself, but if I read the formulae right, the learn levels are

Rank	1	2	3	4	5	6	7	8	9	Gap
A	1	3	5	7	9	11	13	15	17	+2
B (m)	4	7	10	13	16	19	22	25	28	+3
B (a, p)	6	9	12	15	18	21	24	27	31	+4
C (m, a)	1	5	9	13	17	21	25	29	33	+4
C (p)	4	8	12	16	20	24	28	32	36	+4

m = Mage, p = Priest, a = Alchemist

So dual casters get screwed over the most, getting spells way past their period of greatest use, bar 1-3 casts of whatever they can learn from a spellbook. Next time I make a caster, it will be a Priest!

 

[A Lost Cat]

I actually looked into this after the talk about classes before.

The deductions here are on the money. Spell slots, and spells for non-summoners, are gained on level up for any spell level the job has access to naturally, if their casting stat is above a certain threshold. That's Intelligence (internal name intellect) for Mages and Alchemists; and Faith (internal name piety) for Priests and Summoners.

Spellbooks give a free spell slot on learn.
Intelligence feeds into appraisal chance, so that's the main benefit of that ring while we don't have spell damage scaling for casters.
Stat gain is a fixed 0.5 chance regardless of stat, job and race, which doesn't really make sense.


As speculated, Assassin, Lord etc are basically half casters. The three dedicated casters are rank A, the three dual casters are rank C, everything else is rank B.

Spoiler: You'd be able to work this out from the game itself, but if I read the formulae right, the learn levels are

Rank	1	2	3	4	5	6	7	8	9	Gap
A	1	3	5	7	9	11	13	15	17	+2
B (m)	4	7	10	13	16	19	22	25	28	+3
B (a, p)	6	9	12	15	18	21	24	27	31	+4
C (m, a)	1	5	9	13	17	21	25	29	33	+4
C (p)	4	8	12	16	20	24	28	32	36	+4

m = Mage, p = Priest, a = Alchemist

So dual casters get screwed over the most, getting spells way past their period of greatest use, bar 1-3 casts of whatever they can learn from a spellbook. Next time I make a caster, it will be a Priest!

If this is how it is in the code, then that really solidifies my position for starting out making a team with a dedicated Wizard, Cleric, & Alchemist character, to optimize getting the spells faster, then multiclass them for secondary abilities (bishop's purification, dervish/assassin instant kill, etc), extra spell-types (druid bishop or sorcerer whatever has the two types their original didn't), or to convert to a basic-dps or support so they don't have to burn spells all the time (spear valkyrie, sleighbell bard, or whatever)

Having to get to lv 28-36 is pretty terrible, when 17 finishes it off with a straight full-caster.

And it's actually kindof wasteful to start as warrior, hunter or any other non-caster (besides thief since chests are a nightmare without one) since physical skills and stats don't carry over at all, if you intend for that character to classchange at all.

With a little planning and some of the class-change items you can even skip levelling them up if the stats are fine, such as druid -> monk with that really good fighting-staff, or thief -> assassin with the short dagger (though that kindof sucks on getting those alchemist spell slots and levels if you swap this way, iirc, they don't retroactively pop in like how hp will)

 

[CobraPL]

Savegame editor will be needed maybe? Or a mod to carry physical attributes on class-change.
I use Cheat Engine to max all stats on char generator. I just find and freeze remaining points, max stats, set remaining points to zero and continue.

 

[A Lost Cat]

Savegame editor will be needed maybe? Or a mod to carry physical attributes on class-change.
I use Cheat Engine to max all stats on char generator. I just find and freeze remaining points, max stats, set remaining points to zero and continue.

Well, i meant because you don't have something similar to spell slots to carry over, nor do you keep skills like purification/fire arrow/line attack/counter type stuff.

stats just reset to the basic for the class you change to, so i guess you could cheat them up if you got a fat stack on hiring, it does seem like a waste to lose all of those if you manage to luck out getting like 42 points or more, then change class to just get...nothing. wish they were baked into the character.

 

[CobraPL]

ver3.14
Fixed that the image when equipping a great-axe was wrong.
Fixed that the item description on the sapphire city map was not working properly.
Fixed that enemies and guests sometimes use skills when they attack first.
Fixed that you could press the magic button in the guild menu.
Fixed an error when trying to leave the fool's warehouse (enbuged in ver 3.12).
Fixed random encounters immediately after jumping.

translation for this version not provided so far

 

[KillerDxD]

ver3.14
Fixed that the image when equipping a great-axe was wrong.
Fixed that the item description on the sapphire city map was not working properly.
Fixed that enemies and guests sometimes use skills when they attack first.
Fixed that you could press the magic button in the guild menu.
Fixed an error when trying to leave the fool's warehouse (enbuged in ver 3.12).
Fixed random encounters immediately after jumping.

translation for this version not provided so far

Well, bug testing into June doesn't feel like a good sign...

 

[Xebit]

If this is how it is in the code, then that really solidifies my position for starting out making a team with a dedicated Wizard, Cleric, & Alchemist character, to optimize getting the spells faster, then multiclass them for secondary abilities (bishop's purification, dervish/assassin instant kill, etc), extra spell-types (druid bishop or sorcerer whatever has the two types their original didn't), or to convert to a basic-dps or support so they don't have to burn spells all the time (spear valkyrie, sleighbell bard, or whatever)

Having to get to lv 28-36 is pretty terrible, when 17 finishes it off with a straight full-caster.

And it's actually kindof wasteful to start as warrior, hunter or any other non-caster (besides thief since chests are a nightmare without one) since physical skills and stats don't carry over at all, if you intend for that character to classchange at all.

With a little planning and some of the class-change items you can even skip levelling them up if the stats are fine, such as druid -> monk with that really good fighting-staff, or thief -> assassin with the short dagger (though that kindof sucks on getting those alchemist spell slots and levels if you swap this way, iirc, they don't retroactively pop in like how hp will)

Certainly Priest and Alchemist. Since magic damage is ass compared to what a melee character can do every turn, it's really utility spells that are best to get early.

And even then only Repair, Appraise, decent heal spells, and maybe a handful of others not seen in the demo yet need as many casts as you can get. For everything else there's spellbooks and secondary casters who'll get them / get more slots eventually. I guess Mages may find more of a niche that another class can't do better after a few levels / item drops when target-all spells are available.


Reclassing is sufficiently punishing stat-wise that on most characters the best approach seems like getting the job you want immediately, unless you know the one you ultimately want is a high requirement one you can get after a few level ups, or item-promote to.

I think it should keep bonus points over the minimum necessary for the first chosen job, plus any extra stat boosts picked up from barrels etc. It would probably need some deterrent to stop every character/caster just taking a tour through all three basic magic jobs at level 1 to pick up the ability to learn / cast all spells from spellbooks.

Carrying over skills would be fun, but that would make it a very different system.

 

[A Lost Cat]

Certainly Priest and Alchemist. Since magic damage is ass compared to what a melee character can do every turn, it's really utility spells that are best to get early.

And even then only Repair, Appraise, decent heal spells, and maybe a handful of others not seen in the demo yet need as many casts as you can get. For everything else there's spellbooks and secondary casters who'll get them / get more slots eventually. I guess Mages may find more of a niche that another class can't do better after a few levels / item drops when target-all spells are available.


Reclassing is sufficiently punishing stat-wise that on most characters the best approach seems like getting the job you want immediately, unless you know the one you ultimately want is a high requirement one you can get after a few level ups, or item-promote to.

I think it should keep bonus points over the minimum necessary for the first chosen job, plus any extra stat boosts picked up from barrels etc. It would probably need some deterrent to stop every character/caster just taking a tour through all three basic magic jobs at level 1 to pick up the ability to learn / cast all spells from spellbooks.

Carrying over skills would be fun, but that would make it a very different system.

Yeah, priest and alchemist for sure, but mage does bring a few things, like magic eye and eventually apparently, Warp. I suppose mind read is going to have some kind of purpose, hopefully, lol. Also mage magic is very good at early levels, as soon as the wizard gets Fire ring or whatever translated the first row-fire spell is, it puts out quite a bit of damage, especially if the row is wide (but affording the staff that casts it is actually pretty cheap), and thunderblast is nice to have for 3 rows back nailing an important asshole enemy for ~100-ish. The ice spell after fighting the snow dragon sure was a disappointment though, and DPT/damage per turn for lower attack spells does fall off really fast.

And yeah, carrying over skills would be fairly nuts.

Frontliners with priest spells are the best for between-fight topping up with piles of low level slots to burn. tbh, i think valkyrie and monk are good, and lord is just top tier, i wouldn't blame anyone for making a lord and just never changing them

 

[Xebit]

I was thinking over longer terms in general usefulness, but yes, a mage is at their best in those early levels. Which in the full game likely to coincide with the time Riselle with her fixed mage class is a required party member.

Lord is crazy. Having tried it now, it changes fights completely. Protection from incapacitated party members due to capture? Enabling less cheesy dragon strategies than playing hide and seek with an assassin? Combined with MC's counter for damage too? Got it covered.

 

[A Lost Cat]

I was thinking over longer terms in general usefulness, but yes, a mage is at their best in those early levels. Which in the full game likely to coincide with the time Riselle with her fixed mage class is a required party member.

Lord is crazy. Having tried it now, it changes fights completely. Protection from incapacitated party members due to capture? Enabling less cheesy dragon strategies than playing hide and seek with an assassin? Combined with MC's counter for damage too? Got it covered.

The power of Lord is insane. big row of undead? purification. Front line tank powerhouse, most fat swords, (the wide one has stun chance!), healing magic, revival, party-wide cover, and as MC, counter fucking everything. Honestly contender against assassin and dervish for overall best class.

Though, party-covering for dragon breath is likely to end up with a dead lord real quick, though the breath attacks have been nerfed HARD since the previous demo, but their physical attacks got megabuffed. /shrug

 

[Xebit]

The power of Lord is insane. big row of undead? purification. Front line tank powerhouse, most fat swords, (the wide one has stun chance!), healing magic, revival, party-wide cover, and as MC, counter fucking everything. Honestly contender against assassin and dervish for overall best class.

Though, party-covering for dragon breath is likely to end up with a dead lord real quick, though the breath attacks have been nerfed HARD since the previous demo, but their physical attacks got megabuffed. /shrug

Oh yes I forgot to mention they get all the best gear on top of that, plus that skill (didn't see many undead that run).

That strat worked for me against the ice dragon (not tried against Fire). Multi-target attacks like breath aren't intercepted by Protect All, so was just the physical attacks he was blocking nicely. With the two def and one res buffs and periodic healing it worked okay if the dragon didn't use breath too much.