RPG RPG Maker [うさぎめしや / usabox] MaiDenSnow Eve / MaiDenSnow Eve ～さる前夜祭～ (RE115762, RJ115762)

[lazycat]

Re: MaiDenSnow Eve

Vitality 3 overrides vitality 2, so you can't have both of them on the same equipment. Still it's 70% + 15 HP more than the 192 when the appropriate level is reached. Judgement scrolls and hit % of physical attacks are going to suffer with the HP build though.

Bring map scrolls along when challenging the barrier forest. The guiding thread effect makes the debuff go away. I'm sure I mentioned this previously...

4-red essence weapons/equipment is one of the rarest drops in the game. Out of the 300+ hours I've invested, I have a grand total of 1 sailor suit with 4 red essences. I find I don't actually need them since the equipment I really want to expand slots with tends to have 1 red essence in it; this means the conditions for slot-expansion are less severe and the items required much more common to find and use.

I listed them separately to point out that Vit 3 gives 10% HP on top of what Vit 2 gives :v (the 15 max HP is from vit 1 anyway)

And I don't think you explicitly mentions the debuffs goes away, just that the doors all become 'safe to go through' (which I thought was 'no debuff given, this time' effect :v)

.- . And I feel like I'm missing something here, isn't the condition to expand a slot either
A. base weapon with 4 red essences (the universal option)
B. same weapon with 1 more max slot + enough red essences on it that when added to your weapon is equal to your slots +1? (i.e. to expand my 2slotted athame I need 3 slot athame with 2 red essences)

 

[Yukihirou]

Re: MaiDenSnow Eve

Oh, one more thing, anyone here can point me out what the other config option are? I'm tempted to try them out.
@Harley: thank for your help

 

[lazycat]

Re: MaiDenSnow Eve

\' '/ after a run the dwarf have both 3 slotted athame with 2 red essences AND 3 red essence long sword.

Though now I want to get rid of the red Spi1 on my now-3-slotted Athame .-.

 

[Harleyquin13]

Re: MaiDenSnow Eve

I listed them separately to point out that Vit 3 gives 10% HP on top of what Vit 2 gives :v (the 15 max HP is from vit 1 anyway)

And I don't think you explicitly mentions the debuffs goes away, just that the doors all become 'safe to go through' (which I thought was 'no debuff given, this time' effect :v)

.- . And I feel like I'm missing something here, isn't the condition to expand a slot either
A. base weapon with 4 red essences (the universal option)
B. same weapon with 1 more max slot + enough red essences on it that when added to your weapon is equal to your slots +1? (i.e. to expand my 2slotted athame I need 3 slot athame with 2 red essences)

You misunderstand.

Vitality 1: Max HP +15
Vitality 2: HP regen +20%, Max HP +20%, Max MP -20%
Vitality 3: HP regen +40%, Max HP +10%

The effects are not cumulative, so vitality 2 does not give you Max HP +15. You only get the effects listed in the wiki and no more than that.

Since I have a vitality 3 armour, I know for sure that it doesn't give me Max HP +15 and a MP penalty.

You could try having two separate items with vitality 2 and vitality 3 on them, but I'm not sure they stack.

Yes, the debuffs go away only for the next floor. But that's the whole point of having lots of scrolls around in case the floor doesn't have a guiding thread trap. Accumulating map scrolls isn't difficult, nor is sacrificing 1-2 inventory spaces to carry a complete map scroll and one that is partially used (just in case the run lasts 6 floors).

As for the expansion formula, read

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again.

Plain athame with 2-slots: Expand either with Athame knife with 3-red essences or one of the universal expanders (equipment with all 4 slots filled with red essences)

If athame has 1 red essence only: Expand with another athame exactly like it to give you 1-red essence and 1-empty slot.

If athame has 1 red essence and 1 empty slot: Expand with athame with 2 red essences and 1 empty slot to give 1 red essence and 2 empty slots (maxed out).

 

[Harleyquin13]

Re: MaiDenSnow Eve

Oh, one more thing, anyone here can point me out what the other config option are? I'm tempted to try them out.
@Harley: thank for your help

There's not a lot to mess around in the options page, most of it is to do with the game performance. The only thing that should concern players from a gameplay perspective is the +18 options at the bottom. Enable them both to allow hermaphrodite and pregnancy.

 

[lazycat]

Re: MaiDenSnow Eve

You misunderstand.

Vitality 1: Max HP +15
Vitality 2: HP regen +20%, Max HP +20%, Max MP -20%
Vitality 3: HP regen +40%, Max HP +10%

The effects are not cumulative, so vitality 2 does not give you Max HP +15. You only get the effects listed in the wiki and no more than that.

Since I have a vitality 3 armour, I know for sure that it doesn't give me Max HP +15 and a MP penalty.

You could try having two separate items with vitality 2 and vitality 3 on them, but I'm not sure they stack.

-x - Ehhh, maybe, if I ever get a Vit 3 drops on anything I'll try it.

If athame has 1 red essence only: Expand with another athame exactly like it to give you 1-red essence and 1-empty slot.

If athame has 1 red essence and 1 empty slot: Expand with athame with 2 red essences and 1 empty slot to give 1 red essence and 2 empty slots (maxed out).

Actually 1 socket (that's red) requires Athame with 1 red + 1 slot to expand :v

The second example is what I did with my Spi1 Athame.

Though now that I know I can't remove this red essence it makes me less invested in it >_> well, maybe that Black Hand will drops me a Spi3 Athame one day...*self depreciating laugh*

 

[Harleyquin13]

Re: MaiDenSnow Eve

-x - Ehhh, maybe, if I ever get a Vit 3 drops on anything I'll try it.

Actually 1 socket (that's red) requires Athame with 1 red + 1 slot to expand :v

The second example is what I did with my Spi1 Athame.

Though now that I know I can't remove this red essence it makes me less invested in it >_> well, maybe that Black Hand will drops me a Spi3 Athame one day...*self depreciating laugh*

Good luck with vitality 3, I've seen less than 5 of these items drop over my playtime and only one of those was on an armour (my current stray cat).

Correct regarding the formula, I made a mistake for the 1-red example.

Didn't the others advise you to chuck the Spi1 athame for something else? On the other hand there is no penalty for the bonus the essence gives you (which rises as the weapon is upgraded).

Spi3 athame does exist, but I see it spawn more often at the blacksmith than in the wild.

 

[lazycat]

Re: MaiDenSnow Eve

Good luck with vitality 3, I've seen less than 5 of these items drop over my playtime and only one of those was on an armour (my current stray cat).

Correct regarding the formula, I made a mistake for the 1-red example.

Didn't the others advise you to chuck the Spi1 athame for something else? On the other hand there is no penalty for the bonus the essence gives you (which rises as the weapon is upgraded).

Spi3 athame does exist, but I see it spawn more often at the blacksmith than in the wild.

At the time I thought it's to chuck Athame itself (I wasn't as well informed then) >_> so I didn't really remember it til you mention it.

The negative for Spi2/3 bonus is -1 Def .- . considering the build's idea (chug holy vial or force detonator to whittle down enemies at range, Athame's holy + elem3 impacts at close range to melt things) that's somewhat negligible.

If anything's worth worrying about it's Spi3's 10% Spi vs -10% max HP (the rest aren't as important)

Unlike Atk3's -10% Dex since 2h sword gains equal hit chance from Dex and Str and Str will be bigger anyway so it's negligible on that route.

Well, still working on some supplies of punishment/bestseller(the guidance scroll) and maybe +20 my gears before poking my face back to border (got Iron Jack's inscription last time :v but no ink to move it from the ewww heavy collar)

 

[Harleyquin13]

Re: MaiDenSnow Eve

At the time I thought it's to chuck Athame itself (I wasn't as well informed then) >_> so I didn't really remember it til you mention it.

The negative for Spi2/3 bonus is -1 Def .- . considering the build's idea (chug holy vial or force detonator to whittle down enemies at range, Athame's holy + elem3 impacts at close range to melt things) that's somewhat negligible.

If anything's worth worrying about it's Spi3's 10% Spi vs -10% max HP (the rest aren't as important)

Unlike Atk3's -10% Dex since 2h sword gains equal hit chance from Dex and Str and Str will be bigger anyway so it's negligible on that route.

Well, still working on some supplies of punishment/bestseller(the guidance scroll) and maybe +20 my gears before poking my face back to border (got Iron Jack's inscription last time :v but no ink to move it from the ewww heavy collar)

It's not a bad strategy with spi3 athame, but if the enemies DON'T melt after taking hits from the athame you're the one up next for massive punishment. Don't forget there's a HP and MP regen penalty attached to Spi3 equipment; it might not look like much but from someone who's now used to 140% HP regen rates the penalty is unacceptable.

 

[lazycat]

Re: MaiDenSnow Eve

It's not a bad strategy with spi3 athame, but if the enemies DON'T melt after taking hits from the athame you're the one up next for massive punishment. Don't forget there's a HP and MP regen penalty attached to Spi3 equipment; it might not look like much but from someone who's now used to 140% HP regen rates the penalty is unacceptable.

.-. wait wat?

Spi3's effect:
MPR・HP回復効果 -14% 、MP回復効果+14%、最大HP -10%

HP regen -14 I can understand, but it's saying MP regen +14%....I wonder what the heck is MPR then.

HP regen is almost negligible for Spi build since Recuperation = instant full HP (or Protector's Oath w/ Athame which keeps initiative)

Just to be sure, you can only have 1 of the same t3 buff, right? (i.e. Library weapon + armor will have the same stat bonus as Library weapon + Spi2 armor)

 

[Dragonpaladin]

Re: MaiDenSnow Eve

it might not look like much but from someone who's now used to 140% HP regen rates the penalty is unacceptable.

HP Regen rate (HPR) doesn't matter for Magic build Harley. Simply because natural hp regen to us is kinda pointless due to full heal next room anyways.

HP Recovery (回復効果) bonus doesn't need to be stacked either. 140% of 200+ hp heal is 280 HP heal, max hp being 193 and all, you only need like 90 magic to reach 200 at level 20. Considering an endgame magic based glass cannon is at 110+ (usually 100+) you are healing for over 200 with ease. 86% of that is still 172+ HP heal.

Only HP pots and drinking holy water makes a difference, and even then, the holy water is still worth more than vit builds because of magic dependence.

HP pots otoh, Vit build >> magic. But there's the 300 pots and elixir which actually matters for when you are out of mp/holy water. Any other time, protector's oath/recuperation will do.

MPR・HP回復効果 -14% 、MP回復効果+14%、最大HP -10%

-10% HP
-14% MPR (Natural Magic Regen)
-14% HP Recovery (Item/skill Regen)
+14% MP Recovery (Item/skill regen)

Just to be sure, you can only have 1 of the same t3 buff, right? (i.e. Library weapon + armor will have the same stat bonus as Library weapon + Spi2 armor)

Correct for most t3 buff like Library, incorrect for skill, res, hp, mp.
Refer to

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[Harleyquin13]

Re: MaiDenSnow Eve

That's probably a wiki error, or the penalty to mana regeneration cancelling out on Spi3.

As I mentioned earlier, you could try having library 3 weapons and armour on at the same time but I don't think the effects stack. Then again, Dragonpaladin is probably the only person here who can answer the question from personal experience.

99% of the time you magic builds don't really care for HPR, I keep forgetting that the heal magic is extremely strong the more SPI you have. That said, if it's a big room and the attacks don't work, it gets interesting when you get down to 0HP and the green gauge goes back to zero for a few turns.

@Dragonpaladin: I thought HPR was the rate in which HP went up on its own so long as vitality was above 0%. It doesn't have anything to do with the healing abilities.

Since my build only has middling SPI scores, I do rely on HPR on its own to get back 1-3HP during combat especially in the big monster rooms. Every little bit helps the higher the monster level climbs.

Edit: Found the wiki entry for this.

HPR: HPの自然回復に関わる値。表示される値以外にも、残りHPが少ないほどマイナス補正がかかる。= Vitality 3 bonus giving me 140%
HP回復効果: 薬系の消費アイテムや回復系スキル使用時のHP回復量が増加。= Vitality 2 bonus. This is where the items and skills get a boost. I don't benefit from this since my stray cat is vitality 3.

So yes, Dragonpaladin is right in the post above mine. I still hate it when HPR is less than 100% for my character though.

 

[Dragonpaladin]

Re: MaiDenSnow Eve

That's probably a wiki error, or the penalty to mana regeneration cancelling out on Spi3.

@Dragonpaladin: I thought HPR was the rate in which HP went up on its own so long as vitality was above 0%. It doesn't have anything to do with the healing abilities.

Not an error. Refer to my edited/updated post.

Basically, HPR is natural hp regen as you have mentioned.
HP回復効果 is item/skill hp regen and works differently.

As I mentioned earlier, you could try having library 3 weapons and armour on at the same time but I don't think the effects stack. Then again, Dragonpaladin is probably the only person here who can answer the question from personal experience.

If only spi buff stacks up to 20% ._.

Since my build only has middling SPI scores, I do rely on HPR on its own to get back 1-3HP during combat especially in the big monster rooms. Every little bit helps the higher the monster level climbs.

Do not doubt yourself on that, that little bit of hp regen stacks over the turns for vit builds. More importantly, vit significantly reduce amount of physical damage your PC takes to make it matter.

Magic build is a bit different, as long as we have green gauge we can full hp recover. We only worry about being burst-ed down on a single turn, or protector's oath isn't ready and out of holy water. (Happens, which is why I always carry elixir just in case)

MP of course is always an issue, since this game adds penalty to our natural mp regen and max mp. Hence, in long engagement, you have to swap from skills to normal attack. (Angelic halo is really bad if you cannot 1 skill + 1 normal clear the enemy)

 

[Harleyquin13]

Re: MaiDenSnow Eve

Dragonpaladin, have you tried this set-up?

Armour with Spi3
Weapon with Spi3

I know the archivist ability only applies once, but the boost to magic and penalty to defence should apply separately to the character.

Extending this principle to vitality items, it might be possible to achieve lazycat's earlier theoretical building of stacking different items with vitality 2 together to get a huge max HP total at the possible expense to max MP.

 

[lazycat]

Re: MaiDenSnow Eve

Dragonpaladin, have you tried this set-up?

Armour with Spi3
Weapon with Spi3

I know the archivist ability only applies once, but the boost to magic and penalty to defence should apply separately to the character.

Extending this principle to vitality items, it might be possible to achieve lazycat's earlier theoretical building of stacking different items with vitality 2 together to get a huge max HP total at the possible expense to max MP.

Outside of Archivist, Spi2 and 3 difference in stats come down to 20% more resistance to Spi down debuff :v which is pretty negligible really (it's a Hex effect and Consecration removes that so meh)

 

[Dragonpaladin]

Re: MaiDenSnow Eve

Armour with Spi3
Weapon with Spi3

^ Yes, the archivist buff only applies once. The boost and penalty stacks.

Vitality item wise, lazycat's theoretical stacking 2x vit 2 does work. You get the 40% boost to max HP. (Cannot remember if diminishing return applies) However, cutting your 27 mp down to 16ish will kill off your character. Since you need a minimal of 18 mp at all times and I am against putting mp/hp up on weapons. (Though technically you can just swap a weapon)


(Swapping weapon keeps to your current hp/mp pool and only increase the maximum. I forgot whether the over hp is kept though. Need to double check on it.

Otherwise, adding magic 3, vit 2, mp 2, mp 1 to a weapon, heal, and you now have buffer hp and mp)

 

[Harleyquin13]

Re: MaiDenSnow Eve

^ Yes, the archivist buff only applies once. The boost and penalty stacks.

Vitality item wise, lazycat's theoretical stacking 2x vit 2 does work. You get the 40% boost to max HP. (Cannot remember if diminishing return applies) However, cutting your 27 mp down to 16ish will kill off your character. Since you need a minimal of 18 mp at all times and I am against putting mp/hp up on weapons. (Though technically you can just swap a weapon)


(Swapping weapon keeps to your current hp/mp pool and only increase the maximum. I forgot whether the over hp is kept though. Need to double check on it.

Otherwise, adding magic 3, vit 2, mp 2, mp 1 to a weapon, heal, and you now have buffer hp and mp)

It seems a lot of work, but safety-first players might want to consider such an approach. The problem is actually getting a magic3 weapon with 4 slots so longsword, rapier or limbfire are the only choices available. The rest of the essences aren't difficult to pick up.

 

[lazycat]

Re: MaiDenSnow Eve

^ Yes, the archivist buff only applies once. The boost and penalty stacks.

Vitality item wise, lazycat's theoretical stacking 2x vit 2 does work. You get the 40% boost to max HP. (Cannot remember if diminishing return applies) However, cutting your 27 mp down to 16ish will kill off your character. Since you need a minimal of 18 mp at all times and I am against putting mp/hp up on weapons. (Though technically you can just swap a weapon)


(Swapping weapon keeps to your current hp/mp pool and only increase the maximum. I forgot whether the over hp is kept though. Need to double check on it.

Otherwise, adding magic 3, vit 2, mp 2, mp 1 to a weapon, heal, and you now have buffer hp and mp)

What about neck item? (Choker, Cat's Bell, etc) Will it give half of the % bonus if you use Vit 2 on it? (or by some insane luck, just having Vit 3 on it 'A ')

Sadly I've thrown away all my Vit 2 essences, cuz I enjoy having 24+ max MP(let me craft holy vials and still have enough to angelic halo)

It seems a lot of work, but safety-first players might want to consider such an approach. The problem is actually getting a magic3 weapon with 4 slots so longsword, rapier or limbfire are the only choices available. The rest of the essences aren't difficult to pick up.

*coughKnuckleDustercough*

 

[Harleyquin13]

Re: MaiDenSnow Eve

What about neck item? (Choker, Cat's Bell, etc) Will it give half of the % bonus if you use Vit 2 on it? (or by some insane luck, just having Vit 3 on it 'A ')

Sadly I've thrown away all my Vit 2 essences, cuz I enjoy having 24+ max MP(let me craft holy vials and still have enough to angelic halo)



*coughKnuckleDustercough*

No red essences possible on the collar items.

Only half bonus on vitality 2 but all of the penalties.

Yes, I forget about the knuckle duster. Still, it's not like Spi3 knuckle dusters grow on trees.

 

[lazycat]

Re: MaiDenSnow Eve

No red essences possible on the collar items.

Only half bonus on vitality 2 but all of the penalties.

Yes, I forget about the knuckle duster. Still, it's not like Spi3 knuckle dusters grow on trees.

Ehhh D: then I'll probably either shove Spi2 on it or just Vit1 (that 7-8 HP bonus with no drawback)