Re: Aegis Thousand Year War - DMM Online Game
No, I definitely saw that 'the fundamentals of the unit may be strong, but the class is weak' thing. Samurai really aren't plagued by lack of practicality even as a class like they used to be. Their defense is in general not bad when compared to many units with similar roles(mage armor, heavy artillery - both of which have higher costs). Certainly their defense looks underwhelming compared with the new heavy armor defense, but heavy armors needed some leverage over other units, given how underused they were compared to the likes of, say, Hibari.
The 'become one block' feature of several of the samurai is admittedly a bit strange, but it wouldn't be the first class that has a transformational role, either. You could even argue that it's on theme, with their whole identity of being warriors on the battlefield as well as in private duels. At this point it's better to just treat this as one of the potential samurai characteristics and consider 'dueling skills' as a part of what it means to be a member of the samurai class.
What are your 'other' melee support units?
Math doesn't lie - these units have solid AoE dps for a very low cost with reasonably solid uptime. If you're comparing them to blacks like Berna or Kayou, or units with much higher cost, that's sort of missing the point to begin with. Sure they're squishy, but you get what you pay for and they have to have a downside somewhere, and melee supports are generally skill reliant anyway.
The primary point I was hinting at in that paragraph is that you can argue that a lot of classes are nebulously flawed if you're really looking to. There's really only a small set of classes that are inherently strong and weak in practice, though. Judgment calls on unit quality only really starts to become meaningful when you take a look at their individual abilities in most cases. To be a definitively awful class is to suggest that even a 'fair' black in that class may have trouble being good without going above and beyond and giving them some crazy skill, in my opinion, and that's quite a tall order with how units are designed in this game.
Hope that clarifies my thoughts a little.
Again, and I can't believe I have to repeat this: My list was about the "class", not the individual units. While most samurai have niche uses and can be fairly powerful under the right situation, it is not because they are samurai. When you boil it down, samurai are defined by three things:
-Fairly high cost
-High attack, medium/low defense
-Hit all blocked enemies
Hitting all blocked enemies would make them a great sweeper class against early goblin/wolf/imp rushes, but their cost makes this impractical. They have fairly low defense, so they cannot serve well as a tank, and if their skill makes them good at tanking, they are no longer sweeping (with the only exception being Hibari). In other words, there is little to no synergy between the class and the units themselves.
No, I definitely saw that 'the fundamentals of the unit may be strong, but the class is weak' thing. Samurai really aren't plagued by lack of practicality even as a class like they used to be. Their defense is in general not bad when compared to many units with similar roles(mage armor, heavy artillery - both of which have higher costs). Certainly their defense looks underwhelming compared with the new heavy armor defense, but heavy armors needed some leverage over other units, given how underused they were compared to the likes of, say, Hibari.
The 'become one block' feature of several of the samurai is admittedly a bit strange, but it wouldn't be the first class that has a transformational role, either. You could even argue that it's on theme, with their whole identity of being warriors on the battlefield as well as in private duels. At this point it's better to just treat this as one of the potential samurai characteristics and consider 'dueling skills' as a part of what it means to be a member of the samurai class.
For sailors, I cannot say much, as I barely use them. I have a Rinbel for Vepar and an Amelie that I raised when I wanted to put together a pirate-team, and I haven't used either of them outside of that narrow niche because they are just not very good at their intended job when compared to my other melee support units, and they are weak and fragile when their skill is down.
What are your 'other' melee support units?
Math doesn't lie - these units have solid AoE dps for a very low cost with reasonably solid uptime. If you're comparing them to blacks like Berna or Kayou, or units with much higher cost, that's sort of missing the point to begin with. Sure they're squishy, but you get what you pay for and they have to have a downside somewhere, and melee supports are generally skill reliant anyway.
I didn't want to pick dark priests because I don't have any, and I don't want to speak just from looking at their stats on paper, while necromancers are... you know what? If you are really against samurai being on the list, necromancers can pretty much replace them, as they suffer from similar issues. They are supposed to be the heavy-hitter, long-range magic damage dealers of the game with plenty of tokens, but other classes like druids, merchants and even demon summoners make them redundant. I can't even remember the last time I used Metus either for her DPS or her tokens.
The primary point I was hinting at in that paragraph is that you can argue that a lot of classes are nebulously flawed if you're really looking to. There's really only a small set of classes that are inherently strong and weak in practice, though. Judgment calls on unit quality only really starts to become meaningful when you take a look at their individual abilities in most cases. To be a definitively awful class is to suggest that even a 'fair' black in that class may have trouble being good without going above and beyond and giving them some crazy skill, in my opinion, and that's quite a tall order with how units are designed in this game.
Hope that clarifies my thoughts a little.