Discussion Sex MUGEN 2.0 General Discussion Thread

[Ericridge]

Haha, I'm just salty because Mugen's supposed to be collaborative and usually most new folks here either jump in to ask for something or to offer help with the promise of sharing and then disappear suddenly.

Not everyone has the free time or skills needed to create a mugen character.

And secondly, not everyone has complete and comprehensive knowledge on how to create a character.

Lastly, we don't really encourage and help people create new characters. Let's go back to page 1 of this thread and look at very first post. All those links and not a single one is about creating new characters. We can't do shit if people don't have freetime/ or skills to make a character.

 

[Emerald_Gladiator]

Not everyone has the free time or skills needed to create a mugen character.

And secondly, not everyone has complete and comprehensive knowledge on how to create a character.

Lastly, we don't really encourage and help people create new characters. Let's go back to page 1 of this thread and look at very first post. All those links and not a single one is about creating new characters. We can't do shit if people don't have freetime/ or skills to make a character.

heh, I wrote a long ass response to that, but I think I'll keep it as simple as possible, as I realized I wrote long posts about this same subject over and over again in previous posts. Been here quite a while, when Fruitsmoothie created the original thread (dunno if you remember, but this is the second Mugen thread after our first got too long, at least IIRC), and I feel like I've got cantankerous old man vibe mindset nowadays, lol.

All valid points, and I don't disagree with any of your points (at least the first two).
However, the reality is that we're not going to move forward with that mentality. While I was a bit more gung-ho about encouraging folks to do stuff, I've become more jaded with randoms just jumping in asking for stuff without contributing, and posters who actually COULD help (or demonstrated an interest and skill in Mugen) just randomly vanishing all of a sudden. For me personally, I'm happy editing my own characters, and someday, I think I'd be okay with showing proof of what I've been working on. But I understand why Mugenero only posts videos and not characters. It's too depressing sharing with a community that only asks and takes.

Anyway, as usual, it's a tangent and I know I'm not changing anything by posting this.
No hate or anything. Just explaining, if anyone cares, why the current state of H-mugen is as such.

 

[HangerDanger]

heh, I wrote a long ass response to that, but I think I'll keep it as simple as possible, as I realized I wrote long posts about this same subject over and over again in previous posts. Been here quite a while, when Fruitsmoothie created the original thread (dunno if you remember, but this is the second Mugen thread after our first got too long, at least IIRC), and I feel like I've got cantankerous old man vibe mindset nowadays, lol.

All valid points, and I don't disagree with any of your points (at least the first two).
However, the reality is that we're not going to move forward with that mentality. While I was a bit more gung-ho about encouraging folks to do stuff, I've become more jaded with randoms just jumping in asking for stuff without contributing, and posters who actually COULD help (or demonstrated an interest and skill in Mugen) just randomly vanishing all of a sudden. For me personally, I'm happy editing my own characters, and someday, I think I'd be okay with showing proof of what I've been working on. But I understand why Mugenero only posts videos and not characters. It's too depressing sharing with a community that only asks and takes.

Anyway, as usual, it's a tangent and I know I'm not changing anything by posting this.
No hate or anything. Just explaining, if anyone cares, why the current state of H-mugen is as such.

Hmm, well i'm not going to disagree with you here, because i've always believed that people should put in the effort to actually get whatever it is that they want, but the issues with mugen are just way too many for people to actually want to put in the effort and time to get anywhere with it. A part of the reason is the modern mentality that says that as long as you shout loud enough or throw your money for long enough around someone is bound to do things for you (the plague known as patreon), aside from the fact that mugen doesn't exactly have comprehensive documentation all sorted out and put together well enough to actually be of use to your average newcomer. "But it's all out there... somewhere!", you might say, and you might be right, but most people won't know with what forum to start with or even when they do they won't know what to look for and it all gets overwhelming and kills your desire to even try to continue your efforts... I personally had no such problems but then again i am the old school kind of guy and i was back in the day crazy enough to actually play trough DQ7 in it's original language (and i didn't exactly know japanese at that point of time)...

My point with this is that mugen always was and always will stay a niche thing at best as it is right now...

As for Mugenero that is now already a subject that has been debated a bit too much, but i will just say that i have always believed that the one reason he doesn't release his stuff is simply because most of it is just not in any real playable state, therefore he only uses it for videos...

 

[Emerald_Gladiator]

Hmm, well i'm not going to disagree with you here, because i've always believed that people should put in the effort to actually get whatever it is that they want, but the issues with mugen are just way too many for people to actually want to put in the effort and time to get anywhere with it. A part of the reason is the modern mentality that says that as long as you shout loud enough or throw your money for long enough around someone is bound to do things for you (the plague known as patreon), aside from the fact that mugen doesn't exactly have comprehensive documentation all sorted out and put together well enough to actually be of use to your average newcomer. "But it's all out there... somewhere!", you might say, and you might be right, but most people won't know with what forum to start with or even when they do they won't know what to look for and it all gets overwhelming and kills your desire to even try to continue your efforts... I personally had no such problems but then again i am the old school kind of guy and i was back in the day crazy enough to actually play trough DQ7 in it's original language (and i didn't exactly know japanese at that point of time)...

My point with this is that mugen always was and always will stay a niche thing at best as it is right now...

As for Mugenero that is now already a subject that has been debated a bit too much, but i will just say that i have always believed that the one reason he doesn't release his stuff is simply because most of it is just not in any real playable state, therefore he only uses it for videos...

Well said. Totally makes sense.
There are quite a few tutorials on the Electbyte's site and Mugenguild, and YT still has a few. But I understand; it's not easy to learn how to do certain things, and other things take time. Coding and spriting (e.g. creating new sprites) are probably the most difficult and time-consuming. It's not like you can put that on a resume either. Many of the best experts of H-mugen (or mugen in general) don't have time to teach everything or simply don't want to put in the effort to do that either. Personally, I love it when people jump in here with knowledge of H-mugen, because I have so many questions on how to do things (which I can't ask in typical non-H-mugen forums for obvious reasons), but they always seem to randomly vanish. So yeah, it's incredibly intimidating.

That being said, I don't think it's an excuse if you're passionate about it. I think it comes down to entitlement and laziness. We want things and we'll readily ask for them. But that desire isn't high enough to actually do anything practical about it. Again, I agree mugen isn't for everyone and I understand the mentality. I still don't think it's right. I suppose I feel more strongly about this because I can see how much progress we could've made if we had found people willing to put in the work and do stuff. Mugen (or at least H-Mugen) is really only limited by its contributors. And I hate the kind of editor I've become, because I feel like I've worked my butt off not just building my own H-mugen but editing characters for years, and while I'd love to share characters, I can't bring myself to exacerbate this problem of feeding a man rather than teaching him to fish. And so nothing gets done (or rather, I'm stuck just doing things for myself when I could be working with others to make stuff); hell, nowadays even if someone offered to work with me, I'm not sure I'd even trust them enough to work with them.

Haha, I guess I don't really care if what Mugenero's doing is right or wrong (which is the main debate). I also never considered that his characters are only in a semi-functional/playable state, though I'm not sure I believe that, seeing the quality of his characters and the uniqueness/productivity of his work. But something tells me that even if they WERE in a complete state and he were active now, I don't think he'd share them anyway.

 

[Ericridge]

heh, I wrote a long ass response to that, but I think I'll keep it as simple as possible, as I realized I wrote long posts about this same subject over and over again in previous posts. Been here quite a while, when Fruitsmoothie created the original thread (dunno if you remember, but this is the second Mugen thread after our first got too long, at least IIRC), and I feel like I've got cantankerous old man vibe mindset nowadays, lol.

All valid points, and I don't disagree with any of your points (at least the first two).
However, the reality is that we're not going to move forward with that mentality. While I was a bit more gung-ho about encouraging folks to do stuff, I've become more jaded with randoms just jumping in asking for stuff without contributing, and posters who actually COULD help (or demonstrated an interest and skill in Mugen) just randomly vanishing all of a sudden. For me personally, I'm happy editing my own characters, and someday, I think I'd be okay with showing proof of what I've been working on. But I understand why Mugenero only posts videos and not characters. It's too depressing sharing with a community that only asks and takes.

Anyway, as usual, it's a tangent and I know I'm not changing anything by posting this.
No hate or anything. Just explaining, if anyone cares, why the current state of H-mugen is as such.

Yeah i remember the first thread. It reached the max limit of posts something so this is second thread yeah.

Only thing I know that is some sort of program is used to make mugen character, I think its called Fighter Factory? Beyond that. I know nothing.

Now let us look at Koikatsu, that thing has a shitton of characters being cranked out. Espeically from its char maker And I've made quite a few and then edited quite a few so that they are improved. XD On top of that. Information for it is relatively easy to find and get help with.

There's just no questions about it, it really sucks to try and start learning how to make mugen characters.

Then people like mugenero guy is dime a dozen. They always join mugen community to swing their sad inadequate tiny epeen and then disappear. They're nothing special. I don't care. Either there is releases or there is nothing. That's just it. At most, they only make some people who share stuff they make to the public copy their ideas and attempt to reclone the programming from the videos they saw. I do think it is a slowly dying base though.

When given enough time, this current base will die off and maybe a 30 years later there will be a brand new mugen community with none of the toxic shitlords who spends all their time insulting other people for not knowing how to make characters.

I quite like it when there's a random showing up and asking for characters because that means there is in fact, still a interest in sexmugen.

 

[Emerald_Gladiator]

When given enough time, this current base will die off and maybe a 30 years later there will be a brand new mugen community with none of the toxic shitlords who spends all their time insulting other people for not knowing how to make characters.

Eh, the only thing I really disagreed with - If you're talking about me, I don't think there's anything wrong with expressing my frustration with the current state of H-mugen and the lack of support.
Not knowing is one thing. Not wanting/trying to help is another. Falling into both categories and yet still wanting characters is something completely different. I think I've said quite a few times in my rants that I absolutely love it when people ask for help as they either build their mugen or character and that I'm more than happy to offer my limited knowledge. But I hate it when people are asking for handouts. To me, there's no benefit to "interest" when it doesn't support the community.

Nobody's arguing that mugen is easy or that it's for everyone. Right now, I'm trying to reverse-engineer some of the Japanese coding for some of the aggressors who add a CG-style KO scene after the match is over, and it's hell trying to understand anything. I wanna give up. I understand why nobody wants to do the work. But I also think that if we all had that mentality, nothing would get done. New characters don't come out of nowhere.

Again, just an opinion. As with life, you get what you put into it, and your work is a measure of your character.

 

[majesco]

Don't suppose anyone has a working dog aggressor that will trigger stage 2 animations, like those that a bunch of gettag's victims have?
none of my kuros work for it

 

[Dawnstar]

Don't suppose anyone has a working dog aggressor that will trigger stage 2 animations, like those that a bunch of gettag's victims have?
none of my kuros work for it

Don't think that has been made, but now that you mention it that would be pretty cool.

 

[FakeGarry]

I built my own mugen, using his own QoF Redux as a foundation years ago and never looked back. While I've replaced most of his characters (given they're either outdated or I personally edited them myself), I still stand by that some of his collected characters are still the most current versions of themselves and his screenpack is high-quality. If you want to use his QoF Redux in its current state, I still think it's a fine choice. Many of his included characters are fairly compatible with the modern aggressors now.

Thats exactly why I wanted Judael's one,now I see its high quality stuff,I wanted I new one because this one has some minor problems,but they are most because compatibility and the characters' being outdated.I guess I can try to solve those myself,I'll try at least.

As far as the flat-chested Len, I dunno if I have it, but even if I did, I simply can't upload it for fear of loli-related problems (and the possibility actual legal action in my own country, which is why I probably deleted it). Sorry about that (if it were other characters, I might be more generous). However, I KNOW that the flat-chested Len is in Judael's QoF Redux (he had both of them).

Yup,you're right there is indeed a .def file for her flat chested version,thanks again.

There are few links on this thread for that. Some of the older ones are obviously taken down, but IIRC there was a QoF Redux link posted more recently here. I KNOW for sure it's still around the Internet - I found it somewhere in my general perusing a week ago, but I'm sorry that I can't find it again (didn't bother to save it since I already have it). Not doing anything wrong. It's a little irritating for me as a rather veteran poster in this thread to see yet another brand new poster asking for something, but obviously, that's not your fault. Haha, I'm just salty because Mugen's supposed to be collaborative and usually most new folks here either jump in to ask for something or to offer help with the promise of sharing and then disappear suddenly.

I'll search for it,but I have a feeling that my version is either sufficient or it will be the same.And I understand you pretty much,its your mentality and its pretty understandable,you also have a pretty good point there.

Not everyone has the free time or skills needed to create a mugen character.

And secondly, not everyone has complete and comprehensive knowledge on how to create a character.

Pretty much my situation.I already knew what MUGEN was for some time,but I only gathered the minimal amount of knowledge I have now literally two weeks ago.

Coding and spriting (e.g. creating new sprites) are probably the most difficult and time-consuming.

Those are the main reasons for me in most anything I try to do,the spriting part is probably only limited by my poor understanding of basic designing elements (mostly on coloring and lighthing) the real problem here would be coding.

When given enough time, this current base will die off and maybe a 30 years later there will be a brand new mugen community with none of the toxic shitlords who spends all their time insulting other people for not knowing how to make characters.

Eh, the only thing I really disagreed with - If you're talking about me, I don't think there's anything wrong with expressing my frustration with the current state of H-mugen and the lack of support.
Not knowing is one thing. Not wanting/trying to help is another. Falling into both categories and yet still wanting characters is something completely different. I think I've said quite a few times in my rants that I absolutely love it when people ask for help as they either build their mugen or character and that I'm more than happy to offer my limited knowledge. But I hate it when people are asking for handouts. To me, there's no benefit to "interest" when it doesn't support the community.

Easy there lets not fight and make this escalate something bigger,I didn't feel insulted,as I said earlier,this is what he thinks and is pretty understandable.


Anyway,I just discovered that MUGEN is a big universe and didn't had any idea of what I was getting into.But,I will try to learn the "arts of MUGEN" (sorry,you can slap me on my face if you want) even if it takes time.I just wanted to know a few things and probably won't be popping on this forum much more,but you guys helped me and I'm thankful for that.

 

[Emerald_Gladiator]

@FakeGarry : Yeah, no hate or anything. It's not your problem and you didn't know.
And as shown, some people are okay with H-Mugen not growing, which is fine. I've just got a different opinion (and as you can see, I'm passionate about it).

But thanks for understanding. We as a community don't want to dissuade you from pursuing your own interests, whether that's H-mugen, or another game, or whatever.
We're all here to fap. I think that's something we can agree on.

Back to your question: Again, I'd state that Judael's QoF Redux is perfectly fine. I actually have a copy of it alongside my own Mugen, but I can't and don't want to share it (not because of the point I made earlier about laziness and whatever, but rather that it's Judael's own creation and it's inappropriate to upload that. Also, it's big AF). If you're wondering about compatibility issues, feel free to ask here about them and perhaps if you want a specific character, we can point you in the right direction. After all, lots of updates have been made to certain characters, and if you were to ask me, I'd personally augment QoF Redux immediately with Gettag's own H-Mugen, which is quite up to date, or at least use HCM (Hentai Character Mugen), which warehouses H-compatible characters.

 

[Tallsworth]

Is there a list that shows which characters have special defeat scenes for the Minotaur?

 

[nosferatus]

Don't suppose anyone has a working dog aggressor that will trigger stage 2 animations, like those that a bunch of gettag's victims have?
none of my kuros work for it

redflash link wolf test has the knot for victims

 

[majesco]

redflash link wolf test has the knot for victims

Tried the Link from redflash's blog, his wolf special does have a knotting scene but it doesn't seem to trigger any second stage animations in any victims I've tried yet. Still, pretty good. Thanks for the advice!
Always on the lookout for more beasty aggressors, those are the best ones

 

[fennedrake]

Does anyone still have science machine for adults? Also, I wonder if mugen archive will ever unlist their aggressors.

 

[Emerald_Gladiator]

Does anyone still have science machine for adults? Also, I wonder if mugen archive will ever unlist their aggressors.

That one's on HCM (Hentai Character Mugen).
MA is ... well, to be politically correct here, let's just say that their mods and admin aren't going to be doing that anytime soon.

 

[Ricky]

Why not ask some help from mugenryona about the reverse engineering

 

[HangerDanger]

Why not ask some help from mugenryona about the reverse engineering

That in itself is a sort of difficult thing to do right now and i'm not talking about the language barrier, but rather the fact that the japs from mugenryona are sort of on edge when it comes to us westerners even more than your average jap (and this isn't just an unfounded stereotype), mostly because of certain people trying their best to seriously piss them off (Bison and Hip-Ernov-Arts mostly)...

I actually had a nice chat with the mugenryona admin who told me that he warned those two multiple times not to spam, not to shitpost, not to modify other people's work (he meant not to steal) among the other things that they just keep doing over and over again all the while ignoring any and all warnings (now that i think about it the second guy did that sort of stuff even here before he somehow disappeared... was he banned or something???)...

So you can see how that could have caused the relations between the two sides to become somewhat... strained at best...

 

[Emerald_Gladiator]

That in itself is a sort of difficult thing to do right now and i'm not talking about the language barrier, but rather the fact that the japs from mugenryona are sort of on edge when it comes to us westerners even more than your average jap (and this isn't just an unfounded stereotype), mostly because of certain people trying their best to seriously piss them off (Bison and Hip-Ernov-Arts mostly)...

I actually had a nice chat with the mugenryona admin who told me that he warned those two multiple times not to spam, not to shitpost, not to modify other people's work (he meant not to steal) among the other things that they just keep doing over and over again all the while ignoring any and all warnings (now that i think about it the second guy did that sort of stuff even here before he somehow disappeared... was he banned or something???)...

So you can see how that could have caused the relations between the two sides to become somewhat... strained at best...

This right here.

Bison's been reposting their stuff without permission and pissing them off (lol, the password for the double-password protected zip files is "Do_not_steal" now). That HIP-ERNOV-ARTS ... Ah, I think he's on here, or used to be on here with occasional proof-of-concept images. He either doesn't give credit, or reposts edited characters with really minimal (and mediocre) sprites for his own credit/clout. For analogy's sake, it's like if you pirated a video game, or pirated a video game, modded the game to fix a single typo in the script, and then resold it as your own (or with you as a contributor). I'm not saying both of them don't contribute to the community, but it definitely doesn't help the relations with the Japanese side.

Also doesn't help that (not to get back into this) the Westerner side doesn't really do much to contribute. Gettag is the only real source of English-speaking AND decent H-Mugen editing. Most non-Japanese folks have moved on from Mugen. It's definitely a pity that we can't work together though; for IRL work, I actually collaborate with Japanese engineers and they're quite patient and understanding with me as a Westerner when I need them to explain something. So I'd appreciate an opportunity to learn from some of them how aggressors work and to collaborate with them on enhancing existing characters.

The language barrier is still a problem though. And the fact that lots of the spam in the mugenryona board is in English.

EDIT: I probably shouldn't say that there's no capable H-mugen Westerners (creators). But for some reason, they're into furries, futa, and yaoi, so it's a hard, hard pass for me there.

 

[majesco]

Don't suppose anyone familiar with kuro (kuromaru_lite, to be specific) could help me out here?
I've been editing an existing victim to have compatibility with him, I fixed up her relevant sprites and got the 19231, 19232 and 19234 animations are all set up and working but I'm having an issue getting the sprites to fit together properly for 19234, pic related

Not sure how to go about making things fit together (most notably how to get his legs in front and have his cock actually visually enter her, lol) and any help would be appreciated. I'm pretty new to this! Also did anyone ever make a version of lite/a dog agg with his animations that uses the internal shots/impreg cutins? I can't find one, been thinking about editing one together since it's a shame to have those sprites available but not worked in for any aggressors that have proper knotting animations.
Thanks in advance for anyone who can help me

 

[sdriller05]

Does anyone know the command list for Yarimusi and YarimusiHIVE?
Also, are there any better / newer Yarimusi and YarimusiHIVE?
I have an old version, but it seems that some victim characters have an issue of compatibility. Characters are not shown in "chamber" and other issues...
TY!