I got a question about a certain heavily secure H-Artist.

[an anonymous]

Re: I got a question about a certain heavily secure H-Artist.

about toonpimp i think he curentli works on a new game.(it will hafe gay stuf)

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(link to his site)

toonpimp and vanja are 2 english and bad h game producher.
and ther arent many none jap h producher
(thads the only good think to say about them)

 

[Ryka]

Re: I got a question about a certain heavily secure H-Artist.

They are not BAD per se. They just have mistake business structures. (And one has emotional timebomb issues.) In ANY business which produces things, you have to take into account how you want to sell your product.

There are many MANY more ways to do this than "just sell it or don't." To make a profit from your small game industry, you have to take a few gambles.

Toonpimp and Vanja have the more unfortunate decisions, and Toonpimp is way too sensitive to be open for suggestion in that realm. Vanja, I think no one talks to her about this due to her way of rendezvousing the internet and yanking up illegally shared copies, which seems a bit hostile, thus people would think that's a sensitive subject with her.

They could use some business counseling. Or to just do what they're doing. It's their productions anyway. I just want one game ninja style but I guess Vanja's way prevents piracy altogether.

 

[hrpgheaven]

Re: I got a question about a certain heavily secure H-Artist.

This much I can guarantee, the games are NOT marked and they don't have any kind of special "tracer". She just actively tries to prosecute those who share it, people are afraid, period.

 

[Zaiketsu]

Re: I got a question about a certain heavily secure H-Artist.

(it will hafe gay stuf)

And that's bad...how?

 

[PerBert]

Re: I got a question about a certain heavily secure H-Artist.

They are not BAD per se. They just have mistake business structures. (And one has emotional timebomb issues.) In ANY business which produces things, you have to take into account how you want to sell your product.

There are many MANY more ways to do this than "just sell it or don't." To make a profit from your small game industry, you have to take a few gambles.

Toonpimp and Vanja have the more unfortunate decisions, and Toonpimp is way too sensitive to be open for suggestion in that realm. Vanja, I think no one talks to her about this due to her way of rendezvousing the internet and yanking up illegally shared copies, which seems a bit hostile, thus people would think that's a sensitive subject with her.

They could use some business counseling. Or to just do what they're doing. It's their productions anyway. I just want one game ninja style but I guess Vanja's way prevents piracy altogether.

My two cents.
First, you are absolutely right about the fact that they probably could profit more by using different business model.
First of all they have to compete in a pretty limited market: english speaking H-developer can be counted on the fingers of two hands.
Secondly, even when compared with the whole scene of H-game development, they are still not the worst thing money can buy.
I mean most of their platformers are still BETTER than Softhouse Seal's ones.

So if they proposed their games as "pay as you want" DD or on DLSite at bargain price, reasonably they could have decent results.

But they did not.

So this brings me to the point: what's the problem with this?

I won't deny that it's pretty much human instinct to reach for an apple that can be reached, but it's also pretty normal to refrain from it if you see a big sign "please, do not stole my apples, I make a living from it".
I won't deny that I've enjoyed stolen apples shared by others, but I won't go asking for more if they are not available.
If I were to make an effort to solve this contradiction, I believe that it would be better to go for the "I will always pay" rather than "I will never pay".

Because, still, I'm not at ease with not being paid for my work. So I can understand why others are also.

 

[Cactuses]

Re: I got a question about a certain heavily secure H-Artist.

Vanja's just super over protective of the games, I think she might have some sort of daily google search for the zips going on. and if match; rawr rawr rawr

Honestly the games aren't worthwhile to share anyway, considering the above + the fact they are very sub par, whats the point? Saves people from disapointment.

 

[Ryka]

Re: I got a question about a certain heavily secure H-Artist.

Due to some shadowy ninja abilities I obtained my "favorite" game of her series. Let me say right now that I am glad I got it ninja style. Whoever paid for this are in my prayers.

Any game that ends with a minor character calling the cops on the final boss and have THEM save you, should be reconsidered and changed a bit.

I felt sad that day. The gameplay has wonky mechanics, but hat wasn't the worst of it. I'd probably start off with bad mechanics as well. It's just the ending. The boss and the ending. Very horrid. If AVGN was a perv, he'd have some choice words for this.

 

[djweish]

Re: I got a question about a certain heavily secure H-Artist.

Vanja's just super over protective of the games, I think she might have some sort of daily google search for the zips going on. and if match; rawr rawr rawr

To quote Vanja herself:

A big thanks goes out to everyone who's supported me by becoming a member on Ero-Mania. Over time, several people (both members and even non-members) have also protected me by reporting violating links (very often these kind of links are removed before I even find them myself) and refraining from uploading my work to other sites. This really means a lot to me and has undoubtedly been important for Ero-Mania's growth, and that gives me more time, inspiration and motivation to work on free projects like this. Being able to work full-time with my art now, I have more time to work on new projects for Ero-Mania, and also more freetime to do free work (a win-win situation for everyone!^_^), and therefore, I wanted to create this game series.

And really, why shouldn't she protect her IP? She's tring to make a living here, and doesn't want people taking her art/games/etc. for free. That's perfectly understandable.

As a business, some people seem to be suggesting their are other models which could earn her more money. I'm not a businessman, so I have no idea if that's true. What other models would you suggest? From what I can tell, her current model is:

1. People pay a monthly charge to gain access to all works on her website.
2. People can pay to commission a piece (art, etc.) from her.

What would a better method be? Selling each game individually? I was of the opinion that the games weren't of high enough quality to be worth the individual purchase, hence the monthly rate = access to all method.

 

[Ryka]

Re: I got a question about a certain heavily secure H-Artist.

I hate to sound selfish but even FREE is too expensive for what I have witnessed from the ninja shadows.

 

[Raxon66]

Re: I got a question about a certain heavily secure H-Artist.

--Recent customer--
My experience
I'm a fan of her for her art style. She has a very big emphasis on cute. Long ago I obtained Witchcraft 1 from a site and shared it here, unknowingly making a few early birds happy before getting blindsided by the unique situation. Some time later I bought a month subscription to in part apologize and also because it gave me access to everything on her site. Many games, drawings, comics and movies. Well worth the price in my opinion. During the month she also drew a phoenix harpy for me which I was able to get before my month expired. That commission alone would have made me happy. I'll likely buy another month in a year and ask for another commission.

Games: Stages often a bit long and uneventful with unpolished gameplay.
Art: Cute focus. If you like her style you'll be happy. Look at her free stuff to decide.
Customer Service: The monthly subscription is easily turned off with no bad business involved. She is very polite and charming in her response emails and very quick as well. Her website does not spam you or throw ads your way. For those in the closet, she is also discreet if needed. She constantly updates every month and makes it easy to obtain the content you paid for.
Protection: I think it is due to constant searches to eliminate leaked content, marking system, notoriety, and that she doesn't use DLsite.

Bear in mind: The games are not her only output, and given the amount of stuff on her site, arguably not the main.

The way I see it, she produces comics and standalone drawings, and throws in a few movies and games as an added bonus.
Given that, I don't think her pricing isn't as bad as people make it out to be.

Yes, her website does have a lot of content and not just games. Considering all you'll get for a 1-month sub it's not a bad price at all. There's also several of her comic series I like (there's a series called "My Parasite" where a girl gets controlled by a tentacle parasite attached to her body and is controlling her feelings, which is my favorite ), and of course the possibility to request a drawing as a member.

When it comes to her games, the quality has increased over time. Her earliest ones (Lost Hearts, Bondage World, Bibbi's Curse) has got less content, more issues with controls and worse graphics. Her art's gotten better over time as well, including her animations. I love the animations in her newest games (Witchcraft World, Running Panda, Sperm Demoness).

I won't deny that it's pretty much human instinct to reach for an apple that can be reached, but it's also pretty normal to refrain from it if you see a big sign "please, do not stole my apples, I make a living from it".
I won't deny that I've enjoyed stolen apples shared by others, but I won't go asking for more if they are not available.
If I were to make an effort to solve this contradiction, I believe that it would be better to go for the "I will always pay" rather than "I will never pay".

Because, still, I'm not at ease with not being paid for my work. So I can understand why others are also.

Well said.

When it comes to Vanja's games, I see it a bit like this: those of us who likes them, will sign up to her site whenever the site's built up with enough new stuff we think is "ok" for the price of a 1-month subscription (or those who doesn't wanna wait can choose longer subscription plans). Those who doesn't like her games, will just move along and won't care if no free copies are posted. Since they don't like them, they're not going to care. And then you have the ones who do like the games, but doesn't wanna pay, and will use every opportunity possible to bitch about not getting free copies or how "greedy" Vanja is and how much they hate her, and complains about people "white knighting" her. It's not that those of us that are considered "white knights" believes she's some kind of hentai game goddess that never does anything wrong or never could become better at what she do. It's just the comparison between a woman that obviously works hard, listen to all the constructive critique you send her and listen to what the members requests and would like to see, to some people that piss and moan (and sometimes focuses more on ad hominem attacks against her rather than complaining about the games themselves) because they didn't like the games (or couldn't get free copies..) then it doesn't become very hard to choose her side..

And as for the money aspect of things: none of us are sitting around with her income information, statistics on how much she's earned after reducing piracy or any stats of how new signups on her site increase or decrease upon shared items. None of us can say that reducing piracy doesn't help her sales. Heck, some posters here on ULMF have even admitted buying a membership to her site because they couldn't find free copies..a while back I was even one of them

 

[censuur]

Re: I got a question about a certain heavily secure H-Artist.

Why shouldn't she protect her IP?

Because there's nothing there worth protecting, she should be spending that time improving her work, in addition, leaving the avenue open increases your exposure (more people will find you and your work) whereas closing it will mean people will just stop playing your games, quickly lose interest or after having put in effort to acquire your games will be a lot less accepting of any flaws in them, and there are many.

See the deal here is that her work just isn't very good by anyone's standards, it's not an issue if you're charging money for low quality work, I'm sure many of us do understand that the bills need to be paid, but at the same time when you're running your business the way Vanja is you're going to end up destroying nearly all potential goodwill out there, no one is going to want to support Vanja's efforts and growth as an artist/programmer if this is how she acts, as if shes "entitled" to payment for work that is sub-par on nearly every front. As I've said before, there is completely free material out there that is better than her work in every way, she can't possibly be a competing factor when she has literally nothing going for her. I'd be more understanding of her position if she was more accepting of people who don't feel this sort of quality isn't worth paying for.

The results have been fairly clear in this thread alone, the majority being either "Vanja, eugh" or "Vanja, meh" and what little support she does have stems from the white knight category who would defend anything on naive principle alone.

What would a better method be?

Charge for the games, leave any and all pirating alone and appreciate the exposure for what it is, best case scenario people will put you on their radar and may even find your work worth paying for once you get good enough, worst case scenario people don't like your work and ignore you, it doesn't actually cost you a thing and only has potential gains. Crawling up into her ivory tower throwing pebbles at whatever displeases her isn't earning her any favors.

Vanja is apparently working hard at what she does, and I can respect that, but same as that a student generally doesn't get paid for his work despite working hard, the same principle would apply here, until you reach a certain standard of quality your work just isn't going to be worth paying for and demanding it is just shooting yourself in the foot.

 

[azurezero]

Re: I got a question about a certain heavily secure H-Artist.

Because there's nothing there worth protecting, she should be spending that time improving her work, in addition, leaving the avenue open increases your exposure (more people will find you and your work) whereas closing it will mean people will just stop playing your games, quickly lose interest or after having put in effort to acquire your games will be a lot less accepting of any flaws in them, and there are many.

See the deal here is that her work just isn't very good by anyone's standards, it's not an issue if you're charging money for low quality work, I'm sure many of us do understand that the bills need to be paid, but at the same time when you're running your business the way Vanja is you're going to end up destroying nearly all potential goodwill out there, no one is going to want to support Vanja's efforts and growth as an artist/programmer if this is how she acts, as if shes "entitled" to payment for work that is sub-par on nearly every front. As I've said before, there is completely free material out there that is better than her work in every way, she can't possibly be a competing factor when she has literally nothing going for her. I'd be more understanding of her position if she was more accepting of people who don't feel this sort of quality isn't worth paying for.

The results have been fairly clear in this thread alone, the majority being either "Vanja, eugh" or "Vanja, meh" and what little support she does have stems from the white knight category who would defend anything on naive principle alone.

Charge for the games, leave any and all pirating alone and appreciate the exposure for what it is, best case scenario people will put you on their radar and may even find your work worth paying for once you get good enough, worst case scenario people don't like your work and ignore you, it doesn't actually cost you a thing and only has potential gains. Crawling up into her ivory tower throwing pebbles at whatever displeases her isn't earning her any favors.

Not sure if i should be happy people don't make threads about me like this...or unhappy that i don't make enough money to be on people's radar

 

[censuur]

Re: I got a question about a certain heavily secure H-Artist.

I think you make plenty of threads yourself so others don't need to ;P

 

[azurezero]

Re: I got a question about a certain heavily secure H-Artist.

I think you make plenty of threads yourself so others don't need to ;P

yeah but only one or two people come in to tell me why i suuuuuuuuuuck...
which i always find odd because i feel they should complain about my artwork more than anything

 

[censuur]

Re: I got a question about a certain heavily secure H-Artist.

You have some haters I guess, but if I consider myself as the norm here I'd say a lot of people are just waiting for you to get better. I'd say that's a fairly good spot to be in, better than being outright disliked or ignored as can be said about Vanja. To put it harshly, a lot of people are just waiting to see if you'll produce something worth putting their time into, the main issue for people in your line of work is that you need to be competitive, not just in terms of monetary value but also in terms of time invested, and a lot of people can make do just fine with the stuff that's freely available on the internet.

To use Vanja as an example, she does nothing that others don't already do better, and often for free. Starting artists often deviate towards niche fetishes where there isn't a lot of competition already, or niche genre's that the established crowd tends to ignore. In order to compete, you need something going for you, and for most people, Vanja lacks that.

As for you, I can't really say much, I shouldn't be your target audience as I like a completely different style of game so I probably shouldn't even say much here

 

[azurezero]

Re: I got a question about a certain heavily secure H-Artist.

You have some haters I guess, but if I consider myself as the norm here I'd say a lot of people are just waiting for you to get better. I'd say that's a fairly good spot to be in, better than being outright disliked or ignored as can be said about Vanja. To put it harshly, a lot of people are just waiting to see if you'll produce something worth putting their time into, the main issue for people in your line of work is that you need to be competitive, not just in terms of monetary value but also in terms of time invested, and a lot of people can make do just fine with the stuff that's freely available on the internet.

To use Vanja as an example, she does nothing that others don't already do better, and often for free. Starting artists often deviate towards niche fetishes where there isn't a lot of competition already, or niche genre's that the established crowd tends to ignore. In order to compete, you need something going for you, and for most people, Vanja lacks that.

As for you, I can't really say much, I shouldn't be your target audience as I like a completely different style of game so I probably shouldn't even say much here

For some reason i keep shying away from the more heartfelt fantasies I have, like i think im gonna get them wrong or something...

like...there's a problem with the main one...I want a story where a man is turned into a woman, and was honestly all ready wishing they could be...

but from a game perspective there's no conflict in a story like that...
I could make it all about the now woman avoiding getting molested... but then it wouldn't be that happy story i wanted anymore...

oh though that mini plot CAN be used in my concept for a huge rpg as one of the victims...where the person is perfectly happy to live out their life in the game because they get to remain a woman that way...even if it means a life of being a sex slave aswell

 

[Assc0bar]

Re: I got a question about a certain heavily secure H-Artist.

yeah but only one or two people come in to tell me why i suuuuuuuuuuck...
which i always find odd because i feel they should complain about my artwork more than anything

People ready to crap on your works only when you finally release something worthy of their time. I think that's true for any art direction.

Spending time on reviewing your current works, it's like doing a detailed vocal abilities analysis of drunken punks with guitar in my yard.
No offence, I just think that they are too shitty in every single aspect, even more shitty than my English.

 

[azurezero]

Re: I got a question about a certain heavily secure H-Artist.

People ready to crap on your works only when you finally release something worthy of their time. I think that's true for any art direction.

Spending time on reviewing your current works, it's like doing a detailed vocal abilities analysis of drunken punks with guitar in my yard.
No offence, I just think that they are too shitty in every single aspect, even more shitty than my English.

well said

 

[Ericridge]

Re: I got a question about a certain heavily secure H-Artist.

Due to some shadowy ninja abilities I obtained my "favorite" game of her series. Let me say right now that I am glad I got it ninja style. Whoever paid for this are in my prayers.

Any game that ends with a minor character calling the cops on the final boss and have THEM save you, should be reconsidered and changed a bit.

I felt sad that day. The gameplay has wonky mechanics, but hat wasn't the worst of it. I'd probably start off with bad mechanics as well. It's just the ending. The boss and the ending. Very horrid. If AVGN was a perv, he'd have some choice words for this.

Like I said, don't bother.

Not sure if i should be happy people don't make threads about me like this...or unhappy that i don't make enough money to be on people's radar

Your art is superior to her art but your games is kinda boring.

 

[azurezero]

Re: I got a question about a certain heavily secure H-Artist.

Like I said, don't bother.



Your art is superior to her art but your games is kinda boring.

that makes me really happy for some reason