RPG RPG Maker [DEVIL'S OFFICE] SHRIFT (RJ209839)

[ネコマタ狂アラン]

Oh, maybe it's useless no matter what I say.
I've been peeking through this thread for some great people who sometimes send me feedback via direct mail, but it doesn't seem to make sense for me as the creator.
Please contact us directly via Ci-en or Twitter only if you have any impressions other than the killing route or if you get any fatal error.
Certainly, you are free to go any way in this game.
However, I treat them friendly only to those who say they "like them friendly".
I am the creator of them.

 

[Mikufanboy]

Oh, maybe it's useless no matter what I say.
I've been peeking through this thread for some great people who sometimes send me feedback via direct mail, but it doesn't seem to make sense for me as the creator.
Please contact us directly via Ci-en or Twitter only if you have any impressions other than the killing route or if you get any fatal error.
Certainly, you are free to go any way in this game.
However, I treat them friendly only to those who say they "like them friendly".
I am the creator of them.

Huh? They why'd you give us the option to kill them! Don't bullshit me. If you truly wanted to just see them only happy then you never would have given us the ability to murder them and have a route dedicated to just that, alongside the various changes that happen in the dialogue if you befriended them beforehand. As I have completed the game in both routes, I am not biased solely towards killing them, I simply enjoy thrilling and daring storytelling, like BLACK SOULS 2. That Shrift had this option was a great interest to me. I got to both enjoy the vanilla hentai content, and enjoy a daring story. As the creator to both these aspects, I would have expected you to understand both sides of this coin. As long as people enjoy the creation in the end, isn't that all that matters?

Though, perhaps the inconsistency in the machine translation is leading us astray, I would not dare wish to seem like I don't care about the characters, rather that I was motivated to see their despair is another form of sadistic love interest hehe. But either way, I did show my support by buying the game, so I'm guilt free. This forum is easier to communicate desires, it's not solely a developer blog too you know. I don't want to bother you on CI-EN for silly things like this.

 

[Kaerdron]

Just because the option is given it doesn't mean it is favored by the author or even approved. I mean, the game repeatedly show you that going full genocide turns the protagonist in a monster. And the whole point of the "block" is to show that even the more passive monsters want to stand up to Kazuya and the one who is turning him in an abomination by going out of his way to murder everyone. One that is apparently going to be an antagonist in EX4 if I read the author right.

Afterward, you're free to prefer this route to the normal one, but don't be surprised that the creator doesn't like the idea of people going out of their way to massacre everyone like a murderhobo on steroids given the chance.

Also that:

I would not dare wish to seem like I don't care about the characters, rather that I was motivated to see their despair is another form of sadistic love interest hehe.

That's. F*cked. Up.

 

[Civilincubus]

Oh, maybe it's useless no matter what I say.
I've been peeking through this thread for some great people who sometimes send me feedback via direct mail, but it doesn't seem to make sense for me as the creator.
Please contact us directly via Ci-en or Twitter only if you have any impressions other than the killing route or if you get any fatal error.
Certainly, you are free to go any way in this game.
However, I treat them friendly only to those who say they "like them friendly".
I am the creator of them.

The option provides contrast and the choice provides immersion. Personally, I like the karma component of the storyline, if you torture the characters, you'll get your comeuppance in how the game ends. After all non-consenting sadism invites reprisal.

 

[goldendark]

aint it us that controlling kazuya from what hecate was saying to us during the fight with the power we have for reset/close game if anything goes wrong and reloading was thinking she was breaking the 4th wall

 

[Mikufanboy]

Just because the option is given it doesn't mean it is favored by the author or even approved. I mean, the game repeatedly show you that going full genocide turns the protagonist in a monster. And the whole point of the "block" is to show that even the more passive monsters want to stand up to Kazuya and the one who is turning him in an abomination by going out of his way to murder everyone. One that is apparently going to be an antagonist in EX4 if I read the author right.

Afterward, you're free to prefer this route to the normal one, but don't be surprised that the creator doesn't like the idea of people going out of their way to massacre everyone like a murderhobo on steroids given the chance.

Also that:


That's. F*cked. Up.

What kind of nonsense does that mean, not even approved? He created and inserted it into his game! It wasn't some fan mod patch content. If that doesn't imply he wasn't at the very least OK with it then there's clearly some bipolar issue here. What kind of creator injects in great detail things he loathes for his lengthy, hard and passionate novel work? I can only think of tortured artists, and I don't want to believe that as it's quite unlikely. If the creator has a preference for a hero story with harem then so be it, but if he chooses to simultaneously ignore he own creations and the fans that enjoyed a piece of content he created... Well, I guess all I can say is we got baited hard. You don't have to pick either extreme, you just need to be understanding which is the only point I'm getting across here. Mah, maybe with SHrift 2 we just won't get to genocide and all will be normal.

And yeah, sadism in general is a messy business heh.

 

[TheUnsaid]

What kind of nonsense does that mean, not even approved? He created and inserted it into his game! It wasn't some fan mod patch content. If that doesn't imply he wasn't at the very least OK with it then there's clearly some bipolar issue here. What kind of creator injects in great detail things he loathes for his lengthy, hard and passionate novel work? I can only think of tortured artists, and I don't want to believe that as it's quite unlikely. If the creator has a preference for a hero story with harem then so be it, but if he chooses to simultaneously ignore he own creations and the fans that enjoyed a piece of content he created... Well, I guess all I can say is we got baited hard. You don't have to pick either extreme, you just need to be understanding which is the only point I'm getting across here. Mah, maybe with SHrift 2 we just won't get to genocide and all will be normal.

And yeah, sadism in general is a messy business heh.

You can't assume intent that simply.
It could be that the option to be a genocidal maniac exists because he wanted the option of being peaceful to be a choice.

It's important enough that it's a choice that he created an entire route to give the option.

That being said, it's not like both path's are equal in how much of the narrative they give out or how much characterization you get.
Genocide has 0 adult content for that reason.

And yeah, sadism in general is a messy business heh.

Dude I kinda feel bad for you.
You're playing a game where the predominant sexual content is female assertive sex, and ignoring all the sexual content to roleplay an asshole.

Why play a game that's sexual content is literally not to your tastes?
Why play a porn game if you aren't here for the porn?

 

[Captainstarfish]

You're playing a game where the predominant sexual content is female assertive sex, and ignoring all the sexual content to roleplay an asshole.

Why play a game that's sexual content is literally not to your tastes?
Why play a porn game if you aren't here for the porn?

Because he gets off on the monster chicks begging for their lives before he domes them? Maybe he likes the suffering of the MC?

He already said sadism, that's pretty much a given in any game with rape.

 

[super_slicer]

Aren't they trying to devour/enslave your soul? Just killing them seems like mercy or at least a de-escalated response considering what they're trying to do to you. I'm a bit lacking on context though.

 

[Mikufanboy]

You can't assume intent that simply.
It could be that the option to be a genocidal maniac exists because he wanted the option of being peaceful to be a choice.

It's important enough that it's a choice that he created an entire route to give the option.

That being said, it's not like both path's are equal in how much of the narrative they give out or how much characterization you get.
Genocide has 0 adult content for that reason.


Dude I kinda feel bad for you.
You're playing a game where the predominant sexual content is female assertive sex, and ignoring all the sexual content to roleplay an asshole.

Why play a game that's sexual content is literally not to your tastes?
Why play a porn game if you aren't here for the porn?

You can make an option to be neutral or peaceful all the same without a murder option, the majority of vanilla or semi vanilla styled H games are like that. Monster girl Quest RPG is a perfect example of not needing to murder everyone like a psychopath to have choices, with monster girls joining or not. If he really just wanted to be softcore about the story, all he needed to do is throw soft balls. He went the extra mile, I praised him for that, and he finds issue with it? lol

How you managed to come to that assumption I don't know, but I can only assume you're trying to feel for a tone here or got the wrong mental image. Don't waste my time, I won't dignify you with a response if you're going to make an ass out of you and me. You can't tell tone in text, and I wouldn't be in the discussion if I didn't care or enjoyed the H game and it's content.
-------
And yeah some of the monster girls are pretty much carnivores. Some have misunderstandings and some are low intelligence. But with the power of love that all changes as is atypical for most of them.

 

[TheUnsaid]

Aren't they trying to devour/enslave your soul? Just killing them seems like mercy or at least a de-escalated response considering what they're trying to do to you. I'm a bit lacking on context though.

It's ownership of your soul.
You're outside of the cycle of reincarnation because you have magical abilities so your soul doesn't belong to God.

Any monster that fucks you owns your soul, and can even recreate your body if they want.

That being said none of the girls are good heroines at first. You have to go through some struggle with them before they like you. 2 of the girls are just straight up bad and irredeemable. It was bad writing on Shrift's side to even try.

You can make an option to be neutral or peaceful all the same without a murder option, the majority of vanilla or semi vanilla styled H games are like that. Monster girl Quest RPG is a perfect example of not needing to murder everyone like a psychopath to have choices, with monster girls joining or not. If he really just wanted to be softcore about the story, all he needed to do is throw soft balls. He went the extra mile, I praised him for that, and he finds issue with it? lol

How you managed to come to that assumption I don't know, but I can only assume you're trying to feel for a tone here or got the wrong mental image. Don't waste my time, I won't dignify you with a response if you're going to make an ass out of you and me. You can't tell tone in text, and I wouldn't be in the discussion if I didn't care or enjoyed the H game and it's content.
-------
And yeah some of the monster girls are pretty much carnivores. Some have misunderstandings and some are low intelligence. But with the power of love that all changes as is atypical for most of them.

I'm just saying you're assuming author intent. In your case you're assuming based on the amount of work put in.

I'm pretty sure it's not that complicated.

At the end of the day I'm pretty sure it's just that he saw how Undertale endeared people to the characters by not just having small slice of life segments but by giving you the choice to kill them and see the world change.

MGQ monsters joining you or not doesn't actually change the way other characters interact with you or even give credence to the choice at all.

Making an ass? I'll apologize that I was assuming you didn't care about the adult content with how much gusto you were speaking of the genocide route. That's my bad. It's really obvious but just liking the genocide route like you do doesn't preclude you from trying the canon route.

Because he gets off on the monster chicks begging for their lives before he domes them? Maybe he likes the suffering of the MC?

He already said sadism, that's pretty much a given in any game with rape.

There's no domming though?
Is murder domming?

 

[Mikufanboy]

It's ownership of your soul.
You're outside of the cycle of reincarnation because you have magical abilities so your soul doesn't belong to God.

Any monster that fucks you owns your soul, and can even recreate your body if they want.

That being said none of the girls are good heroines at first. You have to go through some struggle with them before they like you. 2 of the girls are just straight up bad and irredeemable. It was bad writing on Shrift's side to even try.


I'm just saying you're assuming author intent. In your case you're assuming based on the amount of work put in.

I'm pretty sure it's not that complicated.

At the end of the day I'm pretty sure it's just that he saw how Undertale endeared people to the characters by not just having small slice of life segments but by giving you the choice to kill them and see the world change.

MGQ monsters joining you or not doesn't actually change the way other characters interact with you or even give credence to the choice at all.

Making an ass? I'll apologize that I was assuming you didn't care about the adult content with how much gusto you were speaking of the genocide route. That's my bad. It's really obvious but just liking the genocide route like you do doesn't preclude you from trying the canon route.


There's no domming though?
Is murder domming?

Don't know if there will be options that'll change the ending to MGQ Paradox yet as it's not finished, the only thing that's truly influenced by your choices is the availability of recruiting certain monster girls due to having other monster girls I.E. Illias or Alice. It's still an option to give a shit about the side quests and the plights of monster girls, it's not genocide but it's an acceptable alternative in terms of softening the story. And much less time consuming, multiple choice games always has the issue of convoluted narratives to keep up with least you make plot holes.

I dunno about that, it's not like Undertale was the first game to have murder everyone options. Soul Nomad was like that too after you did the whole hero shtick. But regardless, it's still something the creator did while not necessarily having the need to, making the protagonist have some evil spirit looking mofo isn't exactly original either, and I'm willing to wager more so that the creator experienced more vanilla settings first before expanding stories like Undertale to get an idea of things. Regardless, it's still a betrayal of emotion to be told you're disliked by the creator who created the genocide route to begin with, because you liked the genocide route. But, again it could have been a misinterpretation so I didn't want to explain it in a way that seemed to offend, just confused.

 

[Anegorami]

Oh my, such a lively thread all of a sudden. Guess it's time to join.

OK, let's go. I will leave all the moral aspect aside, since I have none, and tell one thing that was bothering me straight: having an unbeatable boss is bad game design. As simple as that. Yes, this thread can boil all it wants around "oh no teh killing" and "it's good to be bad", but let's face it, Genocide ending is (it's still there) a good conclusion of the entire route, it sums up all the massacre and, well, rewards the player with inability to load the game after. It's unique, sadistically fun and makes the game complete. Why ネコマタ狂アラン has decided to suddenly put something as dumb (ye, dumb cat level of dumb) as a roadblock made from a challenging yet fun boss is beyond me. The only explanation I came up with is that all this show is provided to hype the people over the game before EX4 comes out. Good marketing strategy indeed.

Anyway, it seems like instead of making the game more enjoyable (which is, just to remind you, a direct responsibility of a game designer) Alan decided to go all the way and double the grind because he can (where is that 15k pure damage skill when Kazuya needs one, both he and Hyakki could just nuke the entire place up, providing more twisted enjoyment to the player who did so many ordeals just to get this strong). Oh well, if that continues that would give me a justified reason to take the challenge seriously and balance the fight for the sake of the game being better. Also, it took less than an hour and less than 50 lines of code to balance out the current form of Hyakki:


Godlike peace of equipment made from entire route? Check. Edge Dagger counterpart? Check. Undertale reference? Check. Any side effects? Nope. In its current implementation it works with every game version up to the current due to the item being added dynamically (saves me from modifying any game files as well).
For those interested in the actual numbers behind it, well:
- Sums up the pure stat bonuses from Condemned Clothes, Old Rosary and Skull Coat.
- Has Bloody Mantle's magic resistance.
- Has halved Lust gain effect from Mystery Cream.
- Gives immunity to Undressed (Shamisen) and Ecstasy (Parasite Juice).
Even with all that, Hyakki is still a challenge, due to sheer attack power and toughness. But at this point it feels fair.
Currently the item is in semi-public open testing, will release the final version next week.

tl;dr: Unbeatable boss bad, softcore cheating is here, looking to get more "Angry" reactions to this post.

Oh, almost forgot:
Mikufanboy

 

[super_slicer]

tl;dr: Unbeatable boss bad, softcore cheating is here, looking to get more "Angry" reactions to this post.

If you piss him off enough he might implement anti-cheat software that verifies the game's integrity and scans for memory editors, ya know? Maybe always online DRM too...

I definitely agree that unwinnable fights are a poor design choice though. Unwinnable fights are deception pure and simple; you are told the rules are one thing but actually they are something different. I've always felt that instead of starting up a battle with unbeatable bosses, the story should play out the same way as any other event you can't influence.

 

[Mikufanboy]

If you piss him off enough he might implement anti-cheat software that verifies the game's integrity and scans for memory editors, ya know? Maybe always online DRM too...

I definitely agree that unwinnable fights are a poor design choice though. Unwinnable fights are deception pure and simple; you are told the rules are one thing but actually they are something different. I've always felt that instead of starting up a battle with unbeatable bosses, the story should play out the same way as any other event you can't influence.

No way, in the end the only person who will lose out would be the developer so he surely wouldn't do that, only the most insecure would add barbed wire along a display shelf, so to speak. And history has shown us that pissing off pirates never ends well, it's always easier to break things than to build them.

I like the idea of unwinnable boss fights, but only in the early stages of the game, as a lesson, motivation, or something. Later on I don't mind if there are bosses that are presumed to be unwinnable but can actually be beaten, a sort of challenge like that is always welcome, especially if it leads to alternative endings to the story like Disgaia for instance. It's a different story if plot armor is saving their ass though, that is indeed bad design in my option.

 

[starway]

I haven't played genocide yet but from what I've heard you get an error and your game gets corrupted after the fight anyways I don't see the point or need to buff the boss to make it unbeatable, maybe the author or us are misunderstanding the comments because of the language barrier?

 

[Kaerdron]

He doesn't intend to make the fight unbeatable, only to make it even more of a chore to beat her to make the conclusion of a genocide run even more frustrating and unrewarding.

On an unrelated note, is accepting Cheshire's offer in EX 3 necessary to complete the Compendium?

 

[Troy168]

He doesn't intend to make the fight unbeatable, only to make it even more of a chore to beat her to make the conclusion of a genocide run even more frustrating and unrewarding.

On an unrelated note, is accepting Cheshire's offer in EX 3 necessary to complete the Compendium?

Yes, because as of now, there's no way to reenter any EX scenarios.

 

[Fossil]

On an unrelated note, is accepting Cheshire's offer in EX 3 necessary to complete the Compendium?

Yes, because as of now, there's no way to reenter any EX scenarios.

Wait, how do you get an entry for Cheshire in the main compendium? Currently at 96% after clearing EX3 but I have no entry for her. I can replay EX3 from an old save if needed.

I know she had a 2nd defeat scene (blowjob) but I have no idea how you see it while playing normally, I've only found it through the Loss Scenes option from the title screen.

 

[FloofyIsGood]

He doesn't intend to make the fight unbeatable, only to make it even more of a chore to beat her to make the conclusion of a genocide run even more frustrating and unrewarding.

On an unrelated note, is accepting Cheshire's offer in EX 3 necessary to complete the Compendium?

Actually no. If you watch her hug loss scene from the main menu, she will offer you an option to unlock that scene after you're done.

Wait, how do you get an entry for Cheshire in the main compendium? Currently at 96% after clearing EX3 but I have no entry for her. I can replay EX3 from an old save if needed.

I know she had a 2nd defeat scene (blowjob) but I have no idea how you see it while playing normally, I've only found it through the Loss Scenes option from the title screen.

You, uh...make Kazuya agree to take it.