Opinion on GoR

[azurezero]

Re: Opinion on GoR

Can we make the distinction that GoR isn't "sex on lose" it's literally the game ends with you being fucked and you get thrown to the title screen. Sex on lose is fine, especially if the game changes based on how you proceed, this allows you to have games where you try hard at a virgin run, slut the character out or simply accept your fate as it happens (i.e. you accept your losses without retrying, whatever consequences that has)

GoR is almost always "bad" when losing is a requirement for unlocking the scenes, losing on purpose isn't challenging or interesting, and while the scene itself might be worthwhile the activity for getting it on purpose will always be tedious. Locking a GoR scene behind bad decisions (going to fight a boss without x item = auto lose) can either work or be even worse (picked up item x while exploring and are locked out of the scene now) and in the end it's almost always better to have alternative means to unlock these scenes. Some games straight up let you surrender, others unlock loss scenes on victory or let you unlock the gallery and whatever you missed once you beat the main game. Ultimately though, failing on purpose just seems like a baffling concept to me, that I'd rather go without.

losing on purpose isnt fun, that's true, it's up to the developer to make things difficult in an interesting way so you don't have to lose on purpose. lillipalace had several examples where you needed equipment or skills to resist specific status effects to advance. if lillipalace is bad for making you waste a turn dispelling a hypnosis spell then persona q is bad for making the final boss a doom timer boss

 

[Thronico]

Re: Opinion on GoR

reward sex feels hollow to me, like take mario for instance...

id have more fun watching peach get fucked if i lose than getting to fuck peach if i won... i think its cause the bad guys can do kinkier stuff

I agree in the sense that reward sex is almost always going to be some type of boring vanilla you don't necessarily want in an H-Game.

But, that's also because H-Scenes in themselves are a reward. I mean honestly, it's what we play the game for.

Taking that same situation with Peach for example though, say you lose, or die or something as mario, it would be nice to have a sex scene, and then have that apply to an overall system where the more you lose, the sluttier she gets and by the time you get to her, if you've died too much, she doesn't want to leave with you anymore anyway. Instead of say, just a single game over screen. Because then it impacts the game itself and adds a layer of depth.

GoR has its purpose in places, but it just always feels tedious, or like there could've been more. Well, aside from a few games where it just makes sense to have a scene afterwards. The issue with that though, is that EVERY time you lose, you now have to watch that scene until you beat the boss/enemy, or quit the game.

GoR works when it's used in games where the main character is without a doubt trying to avoid rape and there's no way it would happen unless she lost. But I don't like GoR in games where they're getting raped by the environments anyway, so now I have to lose a fight and load a save for one scene despite all the others being obtainable without.

losing on purpose isnt fun, that's true, it's up to the developer to make things difficult in an interesting way. lillipalace had several examples where you needed equipment or skills to resist specific status effects to advance. if lillipalace is bad for making you waste a turn dispelling a hypnosis spell then persona q is bad for making the final boss a doom timer boss

Let's be real. Fuck Doom-timers.

 

[azurezero]

Re: Opinion on GoR

Let's be real. Fuck Doom-timers.

using resurection items increased the timer unlike most doom clocks though... the same applied with the hypnosis with it being a gradual thing.
most people didnt notice when i added a gradual hypnosis thing to sd quest that the character also accquires a slap self attack when under the influence since it was at the bottom of the skill list. the idea being to mitigate the damage you do to yourself by slapping and the hypnosis progress

 

[Jesus]

Re: Opinion on GoR

The hentai is what the game is created and played for - Being able to access it only from losing is self-sabotage at best, both for the player and the developer. If you're playing the game "properly", you rarely if ever see it, unless the game in question is difficult, in which cases this means you may find yourself losing to the same enemies over and over, and very quickly that GoR scene not only loses its appeal, but is subconsciously tied to frustration.

As Chain says, it's nice to have when it makes sense. Most games that don't have such scenes are undermined for it (Eg MaTM as another user mentioned) especially if it's followed by a return to the title screen instead of the event being acknowledged within gameplay continuity, but those that rely entirely on GoR to convey the adult content are a million times worse-off.

I'm of the opinion that in H-games, combat rape is not only a nice thing, but essential to the experience. The implementation is more often than not very poor - games where it's triggered on touching an enemy, indefensible or unskippable. Likewise, the defacto standard "mash X to break free" undermines such scenes usually because of their ease, but also being time-critical so as to reduce the amount of damage taken. There are so very few games where combat rape is more or less intertwined with the combat its self. Malise and the Machine and Timer Miko are the only really strong examples I can think of and they're RPGs. I imagine it's a lot harder to pull off convincingly in action games that don't have the luxury of abstracting such a process.

I think the overall concept is fundamentally flawed with the duality of wanting the PC to get raped, but not wanting to lose either. The logical solution is then to have the H only as a reward, but as others have said this often results in boring-ass vanilla content, and if it's rape it undermines the interactive nature of a game.

 

[B00marrows]

Re: Opinion on GoR

Dis is my kinda thread, HAHAHAHA!

[Warning the following is my opinion]

I personally hate GOR as i feel it is a bad design concept.

The idea of "you have to fail at the game to get a reward" is beyond idiotic on a gameplay front. The reward being the porn.

But that is all to do with the game front of it and my issue can be boiled down to "what is a game?"
People have different expectations when they play a game, just like they have different expectations of porn.

I may feel GOR is a cop out but i also feel it sometimes works in a few games, normally occupied by some other more competent porn/gameplay.

 

[azurezero]

Re: Opinion on GoR

Dis is my kinda thread, HAHAHAHA!

[Warning the following is my opinion]

I personally hate GOR as i feel it is a bad design concept.

The idea of "you have to fail at the game to get a reward" is beyond idiotic on a gameplay front. The reward being the porn.

But that is all to do with the game front of it and my issue can be boiled down to "what is a game?"
People have different expectations when they play a game, just like they have different expectations of porn.

I may feel GOR is a cop out but i also feel it sometimes works in a few games, normally occupied by some other more competent porn/gameplay.

gor as a concept works as an experience for the player. it's probably got something to do with the losing is fun idea behind dwarf fortress. I mean, i think that gor is not a reward but an experience.

 

[Enlit3D]

Re: Opinion on GoR

Is there really alot of demand for combat rape tho? One of the first request I get is to make self-strip / self-defeat options.

 

[Thronico]

Re: Opinion on GoR

Is there really alot of demand for combat rape tho? One of the first request I get is to make self-strip / self-defeat options.

I LOVE CR. I mean, I really LOVE it. There's something about knowing that the one place you shouldn't feel safe, combat, is one of the places the PC definitely isn't safe. In games where enemies don't have CR, it just feels like you're playing a regular RPG that threw H-Scenes in there for whatever reason. With CR in the world, it really feels like everything wants to fuck the heroine/hero.

Also, people want a self-strip/self-defeat option because it's easy to assume that an H-Game will have GoR, so you want to assure you can at least get to it a helluva lot easier than spamming fucking Guard. (OH MY GOD, FUCK GUARD, HONESTLY, I BARELY USE IT IN NON-H RPG'S)

Take Violated Heroine as an example, one of my favorite things to do is make Nanaka get groped and raped by the monsters over and over, because it really sets the tone that she's going to be a Violated Heroine. (I'm clever, I know.) If the game had nothing of the sort, it does have a lot of scenes outside of the animations and pose art specifically for that, but it adds something to the overall world that's just more than, "Oh noes, I lost, totally not on purpose, whatever will you do to me that won't matter as soon as I load a save?"

At the end of the day, this is all opinions. I'm really glad this thread blew up so much though. This is fun.

 

[censuur]

Re: Opinion on GoR

Is there really alot of demand for combat rape tho? One of the first request I get is to make self-strip / self-defeat options.

This is inevitable for any game where the erotic content is something you "earn" It's interesting/entertaining to earn a scene through challenge, but if you just want to jack it to your favorite scene after beating a game but have to go through some long challenging slog then that isn't ideal.

 

[TitanAnteus]

Re: Opinion on GoR

Dis is my kinda thread, HAHAHAHA!

[Warning the following is my opinion]

I personally hate GOR as i feel it is a bad design concept.

The idea of "you have to fail at the game to get a reward" is beyond idiotic on a gameplay front. The reward being the porn.

But that is all to do with the game front of it and my issue can be boiled down to "what is a game?"
People have different expectations when they play a game, just like they have different expectations of porn.

I may feel GOR is a cop out but i also feel it sometimes works in a few games, normally occupied by some other more competent porn/gameplay.

The way I see it, GOR's used for two reasons.

Reason 1. They want to write a "good" protagonist. Good as in affinity not skill wise.
Reason 2. Both aspects of playing and losing are fun. Losing is fun because you see adult content. Playing is fun because you progress and see more hot ladies.

I've generally never disliked GOR because of this. I personally like liking the protagonist and I personally hate losing in H-rpgs and H-platformers and having to go back and redo all that work. At least if you lose in GOR games it still feels kinda satisfying.

 

[Jesus]

Re: Opinion on GoR

The way I see it, GOR's used for two reasons.

Reason 1. They want to write a "good" protagonist. Good as in affinity not skill wise.
Reason 2. Both aspects of playing and losing are fun. Losing is fun because you see adult content. Playing is fun because you progress and see more hot ladies.

I've generally never disliked GOR because of this. I personally like liking the protagonist and I personally hate losing in H-rpgs and H-platformers and having to go back and redo all that work. At least if you lose in GOR games it still feels kinda satisfying.

Don't forget Reason 3. Devs are usually lazy and don't put the effort in to making a worthwhile CR system or the art for it

 

[habisain]

Re: Opinion on GoR

gor as a concept works as an experience for the player. it's probably got something to do with the losing is fun idea behind dwarf fortress. I mean, i think that gor is not a reward but an experience.

That's something that always gets misinterpreted. Dwarf Fortress "losing is fun", or indeed any roguelike "losing is fun" is more to do with the journey, rather than the destination. So it's not that losing in Dwarf Fortress is any more fun than in any other game, but the entertaining journey you went on to lose.

It's not an apt comparison for GoR, at any rate. In GoR there is normally no imaginative element; you lose, you get screwed, end game.

I'd also point out that GoR isn't required for morally pure characters - Rape on Lose is one way (i.e. let the game continue afterwards), as is consensual scenes. With my game designers hat on, GoR really just seems like laziness on the part of the devs.

 

[Thronico]

Re: Opinion on GoR

Don't forget Reason 3. Devs are usually lazy and don't put the effort in to making a worthwhile CR system or the art for it

Well, to be fair, we can't necessarily generalize all of GoR by calling Devs lazy. It's obviously incredibly complicated to get an artist on board to do that much. CR requires a lot of different animating and pose arts, so that's why games that feature it are usually more expansive in a sense.

As someone learning code, it's got to be extremely difficult to code for those interactions, which if you don't know how to do, that's more money for a coder with the skill set. There's also the coordination of the idea for each CR interaction the artist has to be aware of, as well as the coder, meaning they need to work in tandem. It's not necessarily a simple thing to do, but god do I believe it's worth it for the final product. Also, it's difficult to want to put so much effort into a game that you check off all these boxes for what you need, when an overwhelming majority of this community pirates each and every game.

I myself am guilty of this. It's hard to justify paying for what is essentially porn, but that's why I believe it's equally important to make a game worth buying. Because, let's face it, H-Games have a much more difficult selling point to work with. That's why I wouldn't call them lazy, now what IS lazy, are those bullshit Scene collector type games, where you just walk from event to event without there being any kind of over-arching story or system or anything at fucking all. Like come on.

That's something that always gets misinterpreted. Dwarf Fortress "losing is fun", or indeed any roguelike "losing is fun" is more to do with the journey, rather than the destination. So it's not that losing in Dwarf Fortress is any more fun than in any other game, but the entertaining journey you went on to lose.

It's not an apt comparison for GoR, at any rate. In GoR there is normally no imaginative element; you lose, you get screwed, end game.

I'd also point out that GoR isn't required for morally pure characters - Rape on Lose is one way (i.e. let the game continue afterwards), as is consensual scenes. With my game designers hat on, GoR really just seems like laziness on the part of the devs.

I agree with that statement about roguelikes, obviously this is just my opinion, but as someone who plays roguelikes all the fucking time, I find myself sometimes getting excited to lose, because then I can buy my next upgrade and go even more fucking ham the next go round. Or if it's a game like Darkest Dungeon, sink even more hours into extending my rage fueled depression.

Losing isn't fun, it never will be, it's what comes after that loss that's great. Roguelikes work because when you die, it's like a pseudo-newgame+.

I imagine in a perfect world, GoR based games would give you the option of loading a save, waking up in the inn with updated sexual stats, OR starting over with the ability to upgrade and get stronger so you can prevent the rape this time around and be genuinely stronger with a sexual stat reset each time so you can still get your virgin run and be OP.

 

[TitanAnteus]

Re: Opinion on GoR

Don't forget Reason 3. Devs are usually lazy and don't put the effort in to making a worthwhile CR system or the art for it

Not every setting works with combat rape, nor does every designer want to create a combat rape atmosphere in their game.

Of course creating the art for it is tough as well. I don't think I've ever seen well animated combat rape outside of MilkQuest, and you only have 1 action in that game.

Even JSK's games aren't completely CR because of the setting and tone he wanted to set taking precedence.

Btw, when has Combat Rape replaced Battlefuck in terms of terminology?

That's something that always gets misinterpreted. Dwarf Fortress "losing is fun", or indeed any roguelike "losing is fun" is more to do with the journey, rather than the destination. So it's not that losing in Dwarf Fortress is any more fun than in any other game, but the entertaining journey you went on to lose.

It's not an apt comparison for GoR, at any rate. In GoR there is normally no imaginative element; you lose, you get screwed, end game.

I'd also point out that GoR isn't required for morally pure characters - Rape on Lose is one way (i.e. let the game continue afterwards), as is consensual scenes. With my game designers hat on, GoR really just seems like laziness on the part of the devs.

Rape On Lose but let the game continue afterwards? As in... GOR with a continue button? I don't get where you're coming from, because that could mean an entire scenario change. MGQ for instance couldn't work like that because that would cause way too many plot threads. If it's just a simple, you get thrown into a dungeon and then have to escape kind of deal, that's just GOR with dressing on the "Continue" button.

Obviously you could have consentual scenes, but setting those up takes time. Time that people generally aren't willing to invest in games that are NOT VNs. Even in Visual Novels people barely even care about the actual adult content. I honestly can't see the laziness you're talking about.

 

[LustFire]

Re: Opinion on GoR

Not every setting works with combat rape, nor does every designer want to create a combat rape atmosphere in their game.

Of course creating the art for it is tough as well. I don't think I've ever seen well animated combat rape outside of MilkQuest, and you only have 1 action in that game.

Even JSK's games aren't completely CR because of the setting and tone he wanted to set taking precedence.

Btw, when has Combat Rape replaced Battlefuck in terms of terminology?

CR is often a feature that is included "with" regular combat. BattleFuck focuses on the sexual context entirely during gameplay. Usually, the games that we consider having "CR" have only the enemies doing the sex on the MC. The problem with this common design for CR is that the developers tend to make it a "attack" action, so the MC doesn't have anything to gain from it. So in this kind of design, the feature is basically pointless other than viewing the sex poses.

I really have some good ideas to make CR a meaningful gameplay, and I wanna do animations for it. But I need to be capable of dishing out the content, as people seem to agree that CR is one of the most difficult genre to produce. :S

 

[chronoex]

Re: Opinion on GoR

I didn't think GoR (Game over rape, I'm assuming?) would be considered a contentious issue, especially considering any developers worth their salt nowadays usually include an option to unlock the rape scene automatically after you beat the boss (if not flat out unlocking everything after you beat the "true" ending)

Assuming we're following the definition that it isn't "Sex on lose" as a previous poster mentioned, I see it as a way to get some nice elaborate epilogue-ish scenes, if done right, detailing your life as a sex slave or, even better, stockholm syndrome coming into full effect. Enokipu's games (Sonabia, etc) contain some excellent examples of this, and they're one of the factors that separate developers who actually put some thought into their H scenes, and developers that just kind of threw it in.

 

[B00marrows]

Re: Opinion on GoR

Btw, when has Combat Rape replaced Battlefuck in terms of terminology?

I think it goes something like:
combat rape = Combat with possibility or rape, useually seen in action games. sidescroller for example.

Battlefuck = The battle is the sex. i think mostly limited to RPG games.

Rape On Lose but let the game continue afterwards? As in... GOR with a continue button? I don't get where you're coming from, because that could mean an entire scenario change.

GAME OVER.
By most games termes this is not meant to be a target, forcing yourself to fail to gain the porn (the other part of a porn game) is a sacrafice in itself.
You secrafice the game to get the porn.
Any gamer knows the a game over is a bad thing, forcing people to deliberatly fail to get the porn is just wrong/backwards on a games front.

I don't think I've ever seen well animated combat rape outside of MilkQuest, and you only have 1 action in that game.

Care to explain this sentance?

 

[Thronico]

Re: Opinion on GoR

. Of course creating the art for it is tough as well. I don't think I've ever seen well animated combat rape outside of MilkQuest, and you only have 1 action in that game.

I kind of go on and on about these games a lot, but you should check out a Shoku game if you want a good example of animated Combat Rape. As far as fluidity and overall quality goes, they always fucking nail it. Especially recently with their newest.

 

[NLL]

Re: Opinion on GoR

I like fantasy raep, and delivering the goods during a Game Over is kinda cool, imo. Obviously, I'd like some H content during actual gameplay, but GoR does a great job of fusing two seperate emotions:

The aversion to Game Overs

and

The jubilation from seeing some anime titties

The resulting sensation is something akin to light masochism, witnessing the character you've been identifying with (the player character) getting molested... it's really unlike anything I've ever seen (or felt) before. I think it's unique to H-games, and I'd love to see it explored further.

 

[Feckless]

Re: Opinion on GoR

Nice poll. I'm sure others have done similar ones before, but it's cool to see a snapshot of what others in this board think about this particular topic.

Personally I have always been a huge fan of GoR games and (Bad End stuff in general), ever since I was introduced to (ie. corrupted by) them very early on. Games like the Des Blood series are some of my fondest memories, and I always get bummed out when I think about how Illusion don't make story driven games with multiple endings like that anymore.

Haven't read the entire thread, but it seems a lot of people are writing those games off as just lazy, which I can sort of understand, but it misses the mark.

It comes down to personal fetishes. I personally don't find any enjoyment in games with prostitution or battle fuck, for example. As the above poster said, it's a form of masochism, which is inherently going against any kind of "reward" for playing the game well (gallery unlocks notwithstanding). Being punished for losing and deriving a sexual gratification from that is the whole point.

In fact, most of the time I play any game with Rape on Lose - GoR or otherwise, I will try to play the entire game without ever losing or exposing my character to H if at all possible, even going so far as to save scum if I felt the loss was undeserved in some way. I then go back later and see what would happen if I hadn't succeeded during such and such scenario. The thought of what might happen is almost as crucial as seeing it happen.