Re: The Ranting/Debate Thread
You may condemn Redwall, but you are still taking an entire section of entertainment and tossing it away, simply because you've been exposed to the good anime that people have decided is profitable in this western market.
I rather enjoyed Redwall, it was a good adaptation of a good series, and with themes and stories that somewhat belied their market towards children. I don't know if you actually watched an episode or just went "gah, animal character fuck that furry shit" and condemned Watership Down as well, but it's a damn good series, and watership down is a classic. So please tell me you've actually sat down and watched a few episodes from the start with an open mind, rather than a handful of AMVs or something akin to that.
Daria and Gargoyles have already been brought up as good western Cartoons. I mentioned Spawn (but you said adult cartoons were good... meaning your contradicting yourself when you've already said that all Western animation is shit), but there's also Kevin Smith's Clerk cartoons. And the Simpsons have had a good run, so has South Park and Family Guy (I'm not a big fan of Family Guy myself).
There's also Ren & Stimpy which is a classic to many, the Smurfs, the cartoon film Valient was actually rather good, I liked the Shrek movies. The old Disney cartoons... there is plenty of great Western animation out there that isn't meant for adults.
And what makes anime so special? I look at a lot and see just as many cliche plots and characters, shitty story lines, cheesy and sometimes downright crappy dialogue. Indeed I have a hard time getting into many animes because I'm not a huge fan of the way Japanese story telling is generally done. I don't say it's bad and there are plenty I can get into, but a majority of it isn't. One of the biggest differences I can see is that anime had some a much more eastern art style (obviously) and it's flashier. Entire animes have been carried by flashiness alone riding atop cliche after crap story but they can be entertaining. Saying Western animation sucks compared to some of these animes is like saying Kingdom of Heaven was a shitty movie because it didn't have the flashy effects of a Michael Bay film.
You cannot hold up something on a pedestal that has as much shit in it as the thing you condemn.