Trapped in the Underdark ~ Out of Character discussion
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OP
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Re: Trapped in the Underdark ~ Out of Character discussion
Tenta, your action is still open. Would like to get everyones actions for the starters.
(Spoiler alert, if a fight is pretty much decided I might skip one or two actions, for pbp reasons, but right now.. ^^)
Tenta, your action is still open. Would like to get everyones actions for the starters.
(Spoiler alert, if a fight is pretty much decided I might skip one or two actions, for pbp reasons, but right now.. ^^)
TentanariX
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Re: Trapped in the Underdark ~ Out of Character discussion
Sorry. Been busy or distracted recently. I will try to get out my post today, for realsies.
Sorry. Been busy or distracted recently. I will try to get out my post today, for realsies.
OP
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Re: Trapped in the Underdark ~ Out of Character discussion
CR 7 and beyond Earth elementals get that feat automatically.
CR 7 and beyond Earth elementals get that feat automatically.
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Re: Trapped in the Underdark ~ Out of Character discussion
Goddamn, 20 damage? Guess Barkskin counts for nothing. In case you didn't look at Lena's sheet, she has 25 AC with Barkskin. Also, what's the DC for acrobatics to remain standing?
Goddamn, 20 damage? Guess Barkskin counts for nothing. In case you didn't look at Lena's sheet, she has 25 AC with Barkskin. Also, what's the DC for acrobatics to remain standing?
OP
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Re: Trapped in the Underdark ~ Out of Character discussion
Meaning the Earth elemental has a 65% chance to hit her normally, 85% from underground, as she can't see the attack coming. (-2 penalty for that and dex to ac is denied), as Zilrax seems to have a fair deal of building experience they will confirm that thats not bad, but also not too impressive defenses for your level.
I usually advice against it to not spoiler stuff for you, but if you are curious go look it up, I'm using a CR 7 level appropriate earth huge earth elemental, no modifications, to test out your group and balance future fights. If I was mean I'd have used an Umby.
Meaning the Earth elemental has a 65% chance to hit her normally, 85% from underground, as she can't see the attack coming. (-2 penalty for that and dex to ac is denied), as Zilrax seems to have a fair deal of building experience they will confirm that thats not bad, but also not too impressive defenses for your level.
I usually advice against it to not spoiler stuff for you, but if you are curious go look it up, I'm using a CR 7 level appropriate earth huge earth elemental, no modifications, to test out your group and balance future fights. If I was mean I'd have used an Umby.
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Re: Trapped in the Underdark ~ Out of Character discussion
Oh I know what they are and stuff, having looked through all the monster manuals a lot over the past couple of years for enemy ideas for my RP threads.
Just 20 damage seems... quite a lot, and in a single shot has already put Lena near bloodied status, or 50% HP. Does not feel like this bodes well. -_-
Oh I know what they are and stuff, having looked through all the monster manuals a lot over the past couple of years for enemy ideas for my RP threads.
Just 20 damage seems... quite a lot, and in a single shot has already put Lena near bloodied status, or 50% HP. Does not feel like this bodes well. -_-
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Re: Trapped in the Underdark ~ Out of Character discussion
You did get Shoryuken'd by solid rock with arms the size of your entire body.
Unrelatedly, lost interest in the 1on1 or missed it?
You did get Shoryuken'd by solid rock with arms the size of your entire body.
Unrelatedly, lost interest in the 1on1 or missed it?
Naira
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Zilrax
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Re: Trapped in the Underdark ~ Out of Character discussion
You called it a Large Earth elemental in the initial post so that explains the confusion. I didn't realize it was Huge.
Elementals tend to do this, they fit in the same role as giants, being large beat sticks, but they also have a few obnoxious abilities. When I thought it was large I was mostly willing to hold back, but a Huge is a bigger deal.
However I'm pushing the boundaries of what someone without Knowledge Planes actually knows about Earth elementals as it is on the basis of being able to summon them, so I can't really recommend the next best option for survival. And frankly, most of you don't have that option.
Considering the opponent and by comparison our actual abilities, I think Lorelai is going to call a retreat and give it a day. We don't do enough damage to kill this thing before it kills everyone else. I think I'm gonna have to swap in Dismissal on it. It's not the best odds of working, but our opponent ignores 50% of our martials damage output and everyone but me is a martial and we're fighting it in the worst possible location.
You called it a Large Earth elemental in the initial post so that explains the confusion. I didn't realize it was Huge.
Elementals tend to do this, they fit in the same role as giants, being large beat sticks, but they also have a few obnoxious abilities. When I thought it was large I was mostly willing to hold back, but a Huge is a bigger deal.
However I'm pushing the boundaries of what someone without Knowledge Planes actually knows about Earth elementals as it is on the basis of being able to summon them, so I can't really recommend the next best option for survival. And frankly, most of you don't have that option.
Considering the opponent and by comparison our actual abilities, I think Lorelai is going to call a retreat and give it a day. We don't do enough damage to kill this thing before it kills everyone else. I think I'm gonna have to swap in Dismissal on it. It's not the best odds of working, but our opponent ignores 50% of our martials damage output and everyone but me is a martial and we're fighting it in the worst possible location.
Naira
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Re: Trapped in the Underdark ~ Out of Character discussion
At the moment, retreat may be the best course of action. Xylia will be highly ineffective in this scenario, and I don't think player death in the very first fight is something desired.
At the moment, retreat may be the best course of action. Xylia will be highly ineffective in this scenario, and I don't think player death in the very first fight is something desired.
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Re: Trapped in the Underdark ~ Out of Character discussion
I didn't specify its exact entry precisely because I didn't want you to meta it up. Well we are dealing with 5 lvl 7 characters, that said, if you need to retreat and reconsider your approach thats fine too.
As I said, this encounter is a bit to gauge your power to adjust the rest of the campaign to, character sheets can't tell you everything.
I didn't specify its exact entry precisely because I didn't want you to meta it up. Well we are dealing with 5 lvl 7 characters, that said, if you need to retreat and reconsider your approach thats fine too.
As I said, this encounter is a bit to gauge your power to adjust the rest of the campaign to, character sheets can't tell you everything.
Zilrax
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Re: Trapped in the Underdark ~ Out of Character discussion
Well sure, but at the same time, I can tell the difference between large and huge. It's the difference of 5 feet of height and 5 foot of reach. It's not like the difference between a skeleton and a skeletal champion, it's literally bigger in a very obvious way. When the difference between a 4 foot person and a 6 foot person is very immediately obvious, the difference between huge and large is like between that of a small dog and a human. It's literally an elephant sized rock. As opposed to the one in the gem. Who is more like a bear standing upright rock.
As for charsheets you can tell in this case. The highest damage dealer is Xylia. She does 1d6+5. So she does 1d6 a hit. The creature is huge, so high hp pools. Assuming it let's us sit there and make full attacks on it, unlikely, it will take us 4 rounds to drop it. If not, it'll take 8 rounds. The earth elemental deals roughly 17 a hit, so it downs in 3 if it doesn't full attack. There's 5 of us. If it makes full attacks, it will probably drop the whole party in 5 rounds. Since our damage drops for each downed person, this increases it's timeline. So assuming all hits land on both sides, less likely for us, better odds for it, we can't win without sheer luck due to it's damage reduction. And that just assumes it doesn't use Earth Glide to it's full stupid potential. Between tremorsense and 15 ft reach it could literally hit us and we could only hit back on a readied action, meaning we couldn't win whatsoever.
Since you can't beat it's damage reduction via any means besides a Smite ability, and there's no Smite Neutral, not that we have a paladin/antipaladin with us anyways, that leaves one of three options. Mind control it, Banish it, Circumvent it. It has tremorsense and no one has air movement but me and maybe Lena, so circumvent is out. I don't think Charm Monster is something Tenta can use yet, so that might be out. That leaves Dismissal.
Well sure, but at the same time, I can tell the difference between large and huge. It's the difference of 5 feet of height and 5 foot of reach. It's not like the difference between a skeleton and a skeletal champion, it's literally bigger in a very obvious way. When the difference between a 4 foot person and a 6 foot person is very immediately obvious, the difference between huge and large is like between that of a small dog and a human. It's literally an elephant sized rock. As opposed to the one in the gem. Who is more like a bear standing upright rock.
As for charsheets you can tell in this case. The highest damage dealer is Xylia. She does 1d6+5. So she does 1d6 a hit. The creature is huge, so high hp pools. Assuming it let's us sit there and make full attacks on it, unlikely, it will take us 4 rounds to drop it. If not, it'll take 8 rounds. The earth elemental deals roughly 17 a hit, so it downs in 3 if it doesn't full attack. There's 5 of us. If it makes full attacks, it will probably drop the whole party in 5 rounds. Since our damage drops for each downed person, this increases it's timeline. So assuming all hits land on both sides, less likely for us, better odds for it, we can't win without sheer luck due to it's damage reduction. And that just assumes it doesn't use Earth Glide to it's full stupid potential. Between tremorsense and 15 ft reach it could literally hit us and we could only hit back on a readied action, meaning we couldn't win whatsoever.
Since you can't beat it's damage reduction via any means besides a Smite ability, and there's no Smite Neutral, not that we have a paladin/antipaladin with us anyways, that leaves one of three options. Mind control it, Banish it, Circumvent it. It has tremorsense and no one has air movement but me and maybe Lena, so circumvent is out. I don't think Charm Monster is something Tenta can use yet, so that might be out. That leaves Dismissal.
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Re: Trapped in the Underdark ~ Out of Character discussion
Oh, you can tell the difference between a large chunk of rock in the dark, surrounded by rocks and a larger chunk of rocks?
Also, geesh, your highest damage is 1d6 +5? you are lvl 7's ye? I mean, Hey, I dun demand you pump out 1d12+20 to go but.. *chuckles*
Oh, you can tell the difference between a large chunk of rock in the dark, surrounded by rocks and a larger chunk of rocks?
Also, geesh, your highest damage is 1d6 +5? you are lvl 7's ye? I mean, Hey, I dun demand you pump out 1d12+20 to go but.. *chuckles*
Zilrax
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Re: Trapped in the Underdark ~ Out of Character discussion
This isn't unexpected.
The rangers are archery or two weapon fighting specced, so they're the type of characters who win through number of attacks rather than single heavy strikes, the sort of builds Damage Reduction specifically is designed to help against. Clustered shots let's archers get around it, but Blue doesn't have it.
The Magus is utility and defense specced, not offense.
I can hit hard, but I went into this with two spell slots sitting useless so that needs to be addressed.
The Rakshasa Paragon is a weird duck of a class who is more of an prey upon opportunistic targets preferably of humanoid nature than elementals. Her damage is okay, she has a few spells, her defenses aren't bad and she has several neat utility tricks for infiltration but most of these don't help against an elemental. And since she relies on several natural attacks instead of single heavy hits... Damage Reduction.
But more than anything, Elementals are brick enemies. Lots of health, lots of accuracy, lots of damage, and a couple gimmicks. Kinda like giants. The best answer to these foes is magic to avoid fighting them in the first place. Otherwise it's a slog. And as the only primary caster, kinda falls to me in this case.
So yeah, Tl;dr, Damage Reduction that we don't have an answer for counters 80% of the party.
This isn't unexpected.
The rangers are archery or two weapon fighting specced, so they're the type of characters who win through number of attacks rather than single heavy strikes, the sort of builds Damage Reduction specifically is designed to help against. Clustered shots let's archers get around it, but Blue doesn't have it.
The Magus is utility and defense specced, not offense.
I can hit hard, but I went into this with two spell slots sitting useless so that needs to be addressed.
The Rakshasa Paragon is a weird duck of a class who is more of an prey upon opportunistic targets preferably of humanoid nature than elementals. Her damage is okay, she has a few spells, her defenses aren't bad and she has several neat utility tricks for infiltration but most of these don't help against an elemental. And since she relies on several natural attacks instead of single heavy hits... Damage Reduction.
But more than anything, Elementals are brick enemies. Lots of health, lots of accuracy, lots of damage, and a couple gimmicks. Kinda like giants. The best answer to these foes is magic to avoid fighting them in the first place. Otherwise it's a slog. And as the only primary caster, kinda falls to me in this case.
So yeah, Tl;dr, Damage Reduction that we don't have an answer for counters 80% of the party.
TentanariX
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Re: Trapped in the Underdark ~ Out of Character discussion
Kiyomi is only level 4 but I gave her Bungle which gives the enemy a -20 to their attacks IIRC, but even that is only a one time deal if I'm not mistaken. I think Jezzy has flare or some other spell that causes the target to lose his/her/its turn but I don't know how well that would work against the elemental.
Kiyomi is only level 4 but I gave her Bungle which gives the enemy a -20 to their attacks IIRC, but even that is only a one time deal if I'm not mistaken. I think Jezzy has flare or some other spell that causes the target to lose his/her/its turn but I don't know how well that would work against the elemental.
Zilrax
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Re: Trapped in the Underdark ~ Out of Character discussion
Daze does that and the save is negligible or it'd be a good idea. I'm talking about your current magus specifically. Flare just gives -1 to attack rolls. I could debuff it a bit and such, but I'd rather do so in preparation to try and dismiss it.
For a Magus, I suggest you pick up Shocking Grasp in your spellbook. It's traditional for a reason. Despite sense, electricity is very effective on earth elementals as it ignores their DR. And one can bolster the power of Shocking Grasp with metamagics quite cheaply.
Daze does that and the save is negligible or it'd be a good idea. I'm talking about your current magus specifically. Flare just gives -1 to attack rolls. I could debuff it a bit and such, but I'd rather do so in preparation to try and dismiss it.
For a Magus, I suggest you pick up Shocking Grasp in your spellbook. It's traditional for a reason. Despite sense, electricity is very effective on earth elementals as it ignores their DR. And one can bolster the power of Shocking Grasp with metamagics quite cheaply.